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Author Topic: best type ball/surface for this pattern?  (Read 2627 times)

Neptune66

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best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« on: May 29, 2010, 01:49:50 AM »
In a summer league at a house I hadn't bowled at in a few years, and I don't know that there's a name for the oil pattern, but is giving me (and others) fits. Outside part of the lane is heavy oil, and backends are not very lively---don't know if its due to oil or what. Yet the middle of the lane is very dry.

If you throw too fast the ball sails past your intended breakpoint, but if you ease up on you speed, the ball hits the dry too early and crosses over and away from the pocket. I'm mostly a down and in player, but if I try to swing it out, it gets lost in the oil or never gets there and ---again, scoots away from the pocket.

I seem to do well at the start, and then game deteriorates until toward the end of the 3rd game, when the oil is dissipating and the pattern becomes slightly less of a factor.

I can't get that technical about pin positions and surfaces, but have a wide range of balls in my arsenal and still don't know what to use. If I use aggresive stuff, I'll be on the wrong side of the head pin most of the evening. Less aggresive equipment breaks late and weak.

Not even sure if I'm better with a pearl or polished surface, or duller one.

Anyway.... If anyone is familiar with this type pattern (reverse block possibly?) and can provide some ideas, I'd appreciate.

Thanks.

 

Good Times Good Times

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #1 on: May 29, 2010, 10:04:47 AM »
"Outside part of the lane is heavy oil, and backends are not very lively---don't know if its due to oil or what. Yet the middle of the lane is very dry"

Based on that quote alone, i'd GUESS reverse block...  Not sure but that'd be my guess.  

Since there's that out of bounds outside, that's out of the question.  However if there is friction in the middle you'll be force to be there.  The weakest piece in you're bag will probably be what you need, and play that middle, just dont leak it out, dont pull it in.......and when you are perfect........have the right combo of hand/"touch"/speed.  

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Neptune66

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #2 on: May 29, 2010, 10:15:04 AM »
That makes sense (to play more inside) and yet for some reason is always the very last thing I try... when I try it at all.  Probably cause I don't have a lot of revs, and if I play more inside with less angle, I tend to get more splits, 10 pins, etc..

So I'll move inside for a while, have some success, and then I'll start leaving 7 or 10 pins and splits, and I quickly abandon the experiment in favor of my comfort zone (the outside part of the lane).

This Wednesday, though, I am going to move inside and try to stick with it all night. Cannot possibly be any worse than last week was.

Thank you!

Good Times Good Times

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #3 on: May 29, 2010, 10:20:08 AM »
quote:
That makes sense (to play more inside) and yet for some reason is always the very last thing I try... when I try it at all.  Probably cause I don't have a lot of revs, and if I play more inside with less angle, I tend to get more splits, 10 pins, etc..

So I'll move inside for a while, have some success, and then I'll start leaving 7 or 10 pins and splits, and I quickly abandon the experiment in favor of my comfort zone (the outside part of the lane).

This Wednesday, though, I am going to move inside and try to stick with it all night. Cannot possibly be any worse than last week was.

Thank you!


Maybe you could pick up an XXXL or a weak urethane and play straight up the "toast"?  Obviously there's a lot of variables but if there's an out of bounds........well.....thats no longer an option
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Neptune66

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #4 on: May 29, 2010, 11:03:18 AM »
Actually... I have a Urethane ball (Storm Natural), but haven't brought it to this house yet.  Was planning to try it last week, and for some reason completely forgot when I headed to league that night. I DID use plastic for awhile and actually did ok for a few frames. Then got impatient with some of the leaves and abandoned it.

Thank you for mentioning Urethane! Using my Natural and/or trying to play more inside, gives me at least two possible ways to combat the conditions.

storm_fan

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #5 on: May 29, 2010, 11:37:02 AM »
Houses don't usally us reverse block.  Reverse block is placing the oil outside and leaving it dry in the middle.  I'd bet that it was a Kegal sport pattern of some sort.  These patterns like the PBA patterns will play like a reverse block because of the oil ratio.  These patterns are a tighter ratio 3/1, or even 2/1 and flatter then your normal house shot.  This means shots right of target hang and shots left of target jump.  Also this paterns are very resposive to speed and hand ajustments. Even if you are accurate you have to keep your speed within about .5 mph or your not going to score well. I have heard a lot of people call a sport shot reverse block because of the way the lanes play.  To my knowlage reverse block isn't even a legal shot.
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Neptune66

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #6 on: May 29, 2010, 01:25:50 PM »
I have tried bowling on a sport shot a few times and actually have less trouble with that as it's flat oil.  Probably has a lot to do with expectations too. When I bowl on a sport shot it's a concious choice and I expect to have to be more accurate and to have lower scores.  It is a welcome challenge.

When I bowl in a weekly mixed summer league, I expect the shot to be at least similar to what I experienced the week before at the same house or the day before at another house. Not backwards.

This week, if it's the same shot, I'm going to ask someone what the shot is.  Would at least like to know if it's deliberate or accidental.

Strider

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #7 on: May 29, 2010, 01:32:26 PM »
Some good info here.  The normal way to play a reverse block is inside, and treat the oil line (the heavier stuff outside) as the gutter.  If you swing it there, it's 3 off the corner or in the gutter.  Most true reverse blocks tend to be very dry inside, so unless you have high ball speed, urethane is probably a bad choice.  If you have room in the bag though, it might be worth a chance.  Normally you want something weak to get through the heads, but something that still has some pop on the back so you can still carry.  Don't expect big scores though.  Keep it in play and make your spares.  True reverse blocks are pretty rare though.  Center owners hate needlessly frustrating their customers.

It might just be a flatter than usual pattern than you're used to seeing as storm_fan suggested.  Although when people don't get the normal "bounce" off the outside, people are quick to blame a "sport shot".  A few extra units outside makes the pattern play very different.  Did they just perform some maintenance on the oil machine?

Also storm_fan, thee is nothing illegal about a reverse block.  Sadly, the only rule for oiling lanes is that there has to be at least 3 units of oil on every board.
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charlest

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #8 on: May 29, 2010, 03:32:45 PM »
quote:
Houses don't usally us reverse block.  Reverse block is placing the oil outside and leaving it dry in the middle.  I'd bet that it was a Kegal sport pattern of some sort.  These patterns like the PBA patterns will play like a reverse block because of the oil ratio.  These patterns are a tighter ratio 3/1, or even 2/1 and flatter then your normal house shot.  This means shots right of target hang and shots left of target jump.  Also this paterns are very resposive to speed and hand ajustments. Even if you are accurate you have to keep your speed within about .5 mph or your not going to score well. I have heard a lot of people call a sport shot reverse block because of the way the lanes play.  To my knowlage reverse block isn't even a legal shot.
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I agree, in general, here. Houses often will not out out a true reverse block.

BUT keep in mind that true flat patterns (like the PBA US OPen) play like a reverse block:
Basically the outside is s true out of bounds, in that only true heavy oilers, with an early rolling drill may make it back from the outside and that's when playing down the boards.
The vast majority of people play 17th/18th board and deeper and will often use a drilling with a high pin with minimum backend.

I'm not sure but the Natural is not the normal type of ball to be used on such a condition because it is urethane and its nature is early rolling. Something on the order of a Fast or the newer Tropical Heat Pearl or Hybrid maybe more in the nature of what's needed. It all depends on how dry it actually is and the bowler's ball speed, rev rate and abilities.


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Neptune66

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2010, 10:14:00 AM »
I am so glad I decided to post this question. I had hesitated, thinking I would be told something like ..."just slow down" or "make your shots", etc..  Everything I've read here makes perfect sense, and I cant wait to get back to the lanes and work at overcoming or adapting to the oil pattern.

Am also glad Charlest mentioned that the reaction shape of Urethane doesn't really match that well with playing more inside. I see it more as two different ways to combat the condition. Either stay outside and use Urethane to dampen the jumping effect when the reactive ball hits the dry part of the lane, or play more inside and use weaker (or at least later) reactive equipment. My plastic experiment worked somewhat, but there was no movement at the end as there would be --hopefully-- with a weak reactive.

Speaking of experiments, had a reactive ball with multiple drillings that I had redrilled about a year ago, intending to use it on very dry lanes, so I asked the driller to drill it for a very weak or minimal reaction. Not sure if he misunderstood what I wanted, didn't care, or it just wasn't doable with the particular ball (Ebonite Big One), but what I ended up with instead, was a ball that goes very long and has a small but very violent snap at the end.

Not a bad thing at all, just very condition specific. Still... the oil pattern discussed could possibly be one of those conditions where this ball would be useful ----if I throw it more inside, or throw it outside and it breaks at just the right point.

Anyway... Wednesday seems so far away now, but I can't wait to go another round with that pattern.  Now I'm hoping they don't change it.

A_P_K

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2010, 11:41:27 AM »
On worn conditions which seem to play like reverse blocks I use weak pearls or plastic.

Whomever mentioned the XXXL, well that's what I use.  I can point it through the OB and when it hits dry it will hook enough to the pocket.  The core helps carry and I find this to be something I don't take advantage enough myself.

I've also had success playing a tiny belly in the OB with a Link and Glad LE.  The OB and carry down appear to slow the transition not allowing the balls to over react in the back of the lane.
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Neptune66

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Re: best type ball/surface for this pattern?
« Reply #11 on: May 31, 2010, 05:15:51 PM »
Not questioning your knowledge or experience, and you could be right on about the rest of the shot, but the backends were not clean. Or at least not clean enough.

At my other house, no matter how dry the lanes are, or where they are dry, if you have enough speed or enough revs, and can get the ball far enough down the lane before it burns up, it will snap at the backend.  On this shot, the backends were not like that. Don't know for sure if they were dirty, but  there wasn't much traction there.