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Author Topic: Rule Question - Substitutes  (Read 2635 times)

DanH78

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Rule Question - Substitutes
« on: April 20, 2007, 01:54:10 AM »
Had a situation come up last nite, couldn't find anything in the rule book.

If a team has multiple "regular" members absent, are you required to sub for a particular person?  

The most games, the least games, highest average, lowest average, best hair?

I'm not asking from a strategy standpoint, I'm asking from a rules standpoint.
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KDawg77

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2007, 09:56:19 AM »
I've never heard of that. I think it's open to who subs for which absent player. I don't think it matters because the scores in a handicap league equal out.
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Djarum

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2007, 10:01:32 AM »
It depeneds on the league.

I believe our league states that a man must subsitute for a man, and a woman must substitude for a woman.

We also instated that during roll-offs, substitutdes can have no more than 10 pens more of an average than the person they are substituting for.

Dj
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Fluff E Bunnie

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2007, 10:10:45 AM »
quote:

We also instated that during roll-offs, substitutdes can have no more than 10 pens more of an average than the person they are substituting for.

Dj


Hey that's a decent rule.  Whenever we get to position rounds, everyone always pulls out these big guns that have only bowled 3 games.
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Aloarjr810

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2007, 10:12:05 AM »
This is from the USBC CAQ's
#5-
If two members are absent and only one substitute is obtained, which absentee score is used?
According to Rule 104a, Item 1, the team captain is responsible for the eligibility of the team and determines whom
the substitute will replace. First, the captain determines whom the substitute will replace and then the absentee
score is determined.
When the team has a limited roster, the process is easy. The captain selects the player the substitute replaces,
and the absentee score of the other player is used.
When a team has additional players on its roster, the captain decides whom the substitute is replacing.
Whoever the substitute is replacing, the absentee score for that absent member cannot be used. According to Rule
105, Item e(2), the absentee score of the player with the most games is used for the other player. If two
absentee scores are needed after the substitute is in place, the absentee score of the absentee with the next
highest number of games is used and when two absent members have the same number of games, the lower
absentee score is used. (See CAQ #9 for cap information.)

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justdale

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2007, 10:12:52 AM »
Being the secretary of a Men's handicap league I can tell you that our league reads; "new subs ( ones that haven't previously bowled in our league) establish the night they bowl". It really doesn't say anything more than that.

I have bowled in leagues before where the man for man, woman for woman rule does take place. I have also bowled in leagues that state that you have to be within a certain number of pins ( it was the 10 pin rule)
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triggerman

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2007, 10:12:58 AM »
were there still blind spots after the subs were in too?  if so then the blind has to go to the person with the most games when figuring the absent score.  I assume this is whta you are asking about?
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DanH78

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2007, 10:15:45 AM »
quote:
were there still blind spots after the subs were in too?  if so then the blind has to go to the person with the most games when figuring the absent score.  I assume this is whta you are asking about?
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It's a 4-man team, 3 regulars were absent.  The team has a 5 man roster.  So the team was 1 regular, 1 sub, 2 absent.
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justdale

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2007, 10:16:38 AM »
Isn't there a rule about how many regulars there has to be?
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ThongPrincess

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2007, 11:48:27 AM »
quote:
Isn't there a rule about how many regulars there has to be?


It is not a USBC rule, but often leagues will put in rules requiring a specific number of "regular" bowlers.  My home center requires 1 regulr on a 4 man and 2 on a 5 man team.
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shelley

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2007, 12:04:06 PM »
Chapter 4 "League Rules", rule 109a covers legal lineups.  For a 4-person team, two bowlers is a legal lineup unless the league rules say one people (part 1b), and subs count towards the total unless the league says they don't (part 2), further clarified by part 3 that says that the league may require a certain number of regular (roster) members.

So a legal lineup may be two people, one roster member and one sub (by part 2) unless they have a further requirement of two roster members (part 3).

We had a case this year where the number of team members required for a legal lineup was three but we had two and a sub.  The rule was carried over from last year when we didn't have roving subs, all subs were rostered team members.  The fairly minor difference was overlooked at the meeting and we got screwed out of the points that night (it just happened that two of us were planning on being out of town with one sub available, the third was a last minute no-show).

SH
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NY Mike

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2007, 12:15:52 PM »
OUr league is mixed. Subs can bowl for anyone as long as the
line up fits leagues standards of male/female qualifications.
When a sub is bowling and a blind is needed, the blind averages are based
on the missing individuals starting with the most games bowled.  Once again
you need to keep the balance of male/female.
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shelley

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2007, 12:19:37 PM »
quote:
OUr league is mixed. Subs can bowl for anyone as long as the
line up fits leagues standards of male/female qualifications.
When a sub is bowling and a blind is needed, the blind averages are based
on the missing individuals starting with the most games bowled.  Once again
you need to keep the balance of male/female.


Our mixed is like that too.  Used to be man-for-a-man, woman-for-a-woman and they still do that on the mixed doubles league on Sunday nights, but the mixed league I'm in just says that so long as at least one man and at least one woman is on the sheet (absent or not, so three men and a blind woman is ok) everything's ok.

SH
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Jesse James

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Re: Rule Question - Substitutes
« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2007, 12:21:34 PM »
In most of my leagues, teams are required to have at least 2 regular bowlers to have a legal line-up. There are never anytimes where a sub will be used during position rounds.
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