BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: hotshot187 on February 19, 2014, 05:05:21 PM
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I had a weird situation last night and was wondering what the correct ruling would be. On my first ball I threw the 7 pin got pushed over to the gutter touching another pin that was in the left gutter and held it up. The pinsetter came down and the seven pin was so far left it picked it up and fell back in the gutter. Anyways they said set it back up as well as the ten since they ten was left and I had to shoot at the seven ten split. In my opinion the seven should not of been up there it was held up with a pin in the left gutter on the shot. What is the correct ruling on this?
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6a. Legal Pinfall
Pins to be credited to a player following a legal delivery shall include:
1. Pins knocked down or off the lane surface by the ball or another pin.
2. Pins knocked down or off the lane surface by a pin rebounding from a side partition or rear cushion.
3. Pins knocked down or off the lane surface by a pin rebounding from the sweep bar when it is at rest
on the pin deck before sweeping dead wood from the pin deck.
4. Pins that lean and touch the kickback or side partition. All such pins are termed dead wood and
must be removed before the next delivery.
No pins may be conceded, and only pins actually knocked down or moved entirely off the playing area
of the lane surface as a result of a legal delivery may be counted.
6b. Illegal Pinfall
When any of the following occur, the delivery counts but the resulting pinfall does not:
1. A ball leaves the lane before reaching the pins.
2. A ball rebounds from the rear cushion.
3. A pin rebounds after coming in contact with the body, arms or legs of a human pinsetter.
4. A pin is touched by mechanical pinsetting equipment.
5. Any pin knocked down when dead wood is being removed.
6. Any pin knocked down by a human pinsetter.
7. The player commits a foul.
8. A delivery is made with dead wood on the lane or in the gutter and the ball contacts such dead
wood before leaving the lane surface
http://usbcongress.http.internapcdn.net/usbcongress/bowl/rulebook/2012-2013Rulebook/Rulebook_12-13.pdf
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I would say if the pin was not down it should be re spotted to the correct pin position..
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I would say if the pin was not down it should be re spotted to the correct pin position..
I agree. I know it stinks, but if the pin is up, it stays up regardless. We were running into an issue with dead wood all night that the sweeper wasn't picking up. We had a discussion on what the rule was if a pin hit the dead wood and knocked over another pin. Example, deadwood on the right hand side, a righty throws a strike, but the 6 pin hit the dead wood before taking out the 10. Someone said you get 0 for the entire frame.
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That's why you should always have dead wood removed before making your shot! If the ball contacts the dead wood it's an illegal delivery and you get 0 for the frame. If a pin contacts the dead wood it's a legal delivery and the pins count!
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I would say if the pin was not down it should be re spotted to the correct pin position..
I agree. I know it stinks, but if the pin is up, it stays up regardless. We were running into an issue with dead wood all night that the sweeper wasn't picking up. We had a discussion on what the rule was if a pin hit the dead wood and knocked over another pin. Example, deadwood on the right hand side, a righty throws a strike, but the 6 pin hit the dead wood before taking out the 10. Someone said you get 0 for the entire frame.
The way the rule reads, you would get a strike. It is only illegal pinfall if the BALL hits the deadwood, not another pin.
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I'd say the pin stands
Everyone is just reading "Rule 6 – Pinfall"
Go on to Rule 7 – Pins
7a. Improperly Set
It is each player’s responsibility to determine if a setup is correct. The player shall insist that any pin(s)
incorrectly set be respotted before delivering the ball, otherwise the setup is deemed to be acceptable.
When bowling at a full setup or to make a spare, if it is discovered immediately after the delivery that
one or more pins are set improperly, but not missing, the delivery and resulting pinfall count.
No change can be made in the position of any pin(s) left standing after the bowler’s first
delivery, unless:
1. The pinsetter moved or misplaced any pin(s), or
2. Any standing pin(s) is (are) outside the range of the sweep bar.
Any such pin(s) will be respotted where it (they) originally stood before the delivery.
7b. Rebounding
Pins that rebound and stand on the lane must be counted as standing pins.
7c. Replacement
Should a pin be broken or otherwise badly damaged during the game, it shall be replaced at once by
another pin as nearly uniform in weight and condition with the set in use. The league or tournament
officials shall determine whether pins shall be replaced.
A broken pin does not change the score made by the bowler. The pins knocked down are counted,
after which the broken pin is replaced.
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Aloarjr810, I agree, the OP's pin should be respot. I was only referring to the deadwood question.
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Aloarjr810, I agree, the OP's pin should be respot. I was only referring to the deadwood question.
I was just commenting on the OP's post and the thread in general not yours.
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I guess i am still confused. There was no dead wood before the shot. What happened was on my first shot somehow a pin ended up on the sidewall by the left gutter and the seven was touching the pin in the gutter. The seven pin was in the gutter being held up by the pin that somehow ended up there on my shot. The pinsetter came down and it was so far left in the gutter it picked it up and then fell back into the gutter. There was no dead wood before prior shot it all happened at the same time.
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I believe the deadwood reference was about a comment made by Spider Ball Bowler about a issue with deadwood he had not your org.post.
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I misunderstood the op on the pin and thought there was dead wood. If the pin setter touched the pin and it fell, then it does need to be repotted.
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If the pin was in the gutter, then its done and considered knocked down. It makes no difference that the machine picked the pin up.