BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: bowlingnut76 on October 11, 2013, 07:36:37 AM
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been on this site for a while....and I'm seen them come and go...which company or company's will be successful and who will fail...or are all three going to survive...so show your support....lane 1 i still around but haven't heard nothing from there supporters on here lately....maybe lane 1 folds who knows what the future holds...sound off let me here your opinions on here...
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Motiv is established and picking up a lot of steam, they aren't going anywhere. Lord Field I don't think will get past where they're at unless their marketing improves quite a bit, ugly colors and mediocre names at best don't sell balls whether the performance is good or not, and the group that just pays attention to performance is pretty small. Seismic depends on another company for their coverstocks, and I've heard 900 Global isn't doing that great.
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Have to agree on Motiv sticking around. I wasn't a fan of their early stuff but they've got some high quality stuff out now that give me some great reactions. Not only that but the neomark graphics make them unique looking. That'll do nothing but help.
Matt
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Lord Field has Chinese backing so I can see them sticking around for awhile. Their equipment seems to hold up very very well, durability wise. Motiv is a made in the USA brand with excellent backing and a huge following. Taking the leap to go full registration on tour and having a great young PBA staff will raise their presence I'm sure. Seismic has been around for awhile now. I've been out of the game for about 4-5 years now so I'm not sure what their pro shop presence is like nationwide, but if 900 Global is still pouring their stuff, then I'm sure they will be around for a few more years to come at least (barring another huge decline in bowling).
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+1 with Gizmo. Motiv has done an incredible job of marketing, customer service, and performance of equipment. I have seen Seismic gain headway with their releases but with 1/4" thick covers, I see them going the same route as AMF/Global. Great for a few months but then oil soaks in and either they roll out or crack. (Speaking from experience with my own amf/global equipment and working in the shop). I have not been impressed with the Venator, however, I do like Epicenter and Dominion.
I have seen 3 Lord Field balls in person, one was due to cracking, and two in someones hands. They had a good look but they weren't anything spectacular. Then a few weeks later, they stopped throwing them and I haven't seen them since. This, in no way, is me saying their balls are not good but I'm just thinking in the sense of a pro shop owner, what's the incentive? What can I say about LF to sell to my customers? What makes their High Performance Piece as good or better than Radical, DV8, Storm/Roto, etc. What midpoint ball is going to de-throne the Hyroad Pearl, Deranged, Torrid Affair, etc? What Low End is going to be more of a "bang for your buck" than the Wrecker, 300C Solid, etc... These are questions that need to be addressed and advertised before I can honestly tell a customer this ball is going to be better than what you know and see everyday.
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seen couple motiv pieces last year where i bowled...three years ago seen one person throwing strictly lane one had pink panther ball,other lane 1 pieces..could forget the pepto pink ball....that's it three years 1 person with lane one...no seismic, or lordfield...lordfield/lanemasters...come out with lot of product lately...also they dint produce sequels...judgement ball seem to be quite a hit in here why not expand on that make hybrid,or solid,or a pearl version..and call it judgement day or something along those lines...like the big boys do..even motiv has sequels...cruel intent got me intrested....just saying lordfield seems are just producing and pushing lot of product out to fast...need to slow down think about what there doing...lane 1 if they try a different core all toghter i might try a new ball from them....they been riding the same train for so long I'm surprised they are still in business....
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I beleive Gunny measured the cover thickness on his stuff and found it was the same as Storm.
also, I had a Solaris Requiem that had well in excess of 100 games on it that still hooked like it was brand new. My Blackout has 200 games on it with no loss of power. Both of those balls came BEFORE I was on staff.
+1 with Gizmo. Motiv has done an incredible job of marketing, customer service, and performance of equipment. I have seen Seismic gain headway with their releases but with 1/4" thick covers, I see them going the same route as AMF/Global. Great for a few months but then oil soaks in and either they roll out or crack. (Speaking from experience with my own amf/global equipment and working in the shop). I have not been impressed with the Venator, however, I do like Epicenter and Dominion.
I have seen 3 Lord Field balls in person, one was due to cracking, and two in someones hands. They had a good look but they weren't anything spectacular. Then a few weeks later, they stopped throwing them and I haven't seen them since. This, in no way, is me saying their balls are not good but I'm just thinking in the sense of a pro shop owner, what's the incentive? What can I say about LF to sell to my customers? What makes their High Performance Piece as good or better than Radical, DV8, Storm/Roto, etc. What midpoint ball is going to de-throne the Hyroad Pearl, Deranged, Torrid Affair, etc? What Low End is going to be more of a "bang for your buck" than the Wrecker, 300C Solid, etc... These are questions that need to be addressed and advertised before I can honestly tell a customer this ball is going to be better than what you know and see everyday.
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+1 with Gizmo. Motiv has done an incredible job of marketing, customer service, and performance of equipment. I have seen Seismic gain headway with their releases but with 1/4" thick covers, I see them going the same route as AMF/Global. Great for a few months but then oil soaks in and either they roll out or crack. (Speaking from experience with my own amf/global equipment and working in the shop). I have not been impressed with the Venator, however, I do like Epicenter and Dominion.
I have seen 3 Lord Field balls in person, one was due to cracking, and two in someones hands. They had a good look but they weren't anything spectacular. Then a few weeks later, they stopped throwing them and I haven't seen them since. This, in no way, is me saying their balls are not good but I'm just thinking in the sense of a pro shop owner, what's the incentive? What can I say about LF to sell to my customers? What makes their High Performance Piece as good or better than Radical, DV8, Storm/Roto, etc. What midpoint ball is going to de-throne the Hyroad Pearl, Deranged, Torrid Affair, etc? What Low End is going to be more of a "bang for your buck" than the Wrecker, 300C Solid, etc... These are questions that need to be addressed and advertised before I can honestly tell a customer this ball is going to be better than what you know and see everyday.
Good post and about sums up what I feel also.
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Heres what i see:
One company is pretty much doing everything right.
One has a big $ stream and believes in their people...LOTS of staff.
One I just cant figure out.
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As far as Seismic, after I read all of the the "thickness of cover" concerns, I went and measure my Blackout, Dominion, Venator and Platinum, all three were slightly under 1/2 inch and I mean slightly. I also measure my Nomad, Defiant Soul and Nano. The Nano was at 1/2 exactly and the others were slightly under. So I don't see Seismic having those issues. My Blackout has at least 150 games on it and it performs as new. Ive been incredibly impressed with the Seismic equipment, yes the Venator is condition specific for me, but all of the others I have owned have been absolutely some of the best I have ever thrown. The Blackout is in the top two!! The Platinum is also climbing the list quickly.
I am not on any staff, I dont know much about LF, but I can say that if Seismic continues and markets the balls better they will make it and grow!
Motiv has a great following and some great stuff and will continue to grow. Their new releases are excellent!
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I beleive Gunny measured the cover thickness on his stuff and found it was the same as Storm.
also, I had a Solaris Requiem that had well in excess of 100 games on it that still hooked like it was brand new. My Blackout has 200 games on it with no loss of power. Both of those balls came BEFORE I was on staff.
+1 with Gizmo. Motiv has done an incredible job of marketing, customer service, and performance of equipment. I have seen Seismic gain headway with their releases but with 1/4" thick covers, I see them going the same route as AMF/Global. Great for a few months but then oil soaks in and either they roll out or crack. (Speaking from experience with my own amf/global equipment and working in the shop). I have not been impressed with the Venator, however, I do like Epicenter and Dominion.
I have seen 3 Lord Field balls in person, one was due to cracking, and two in someones hands. They had a good look but they weren't anything spectacular. Then a few weeks later, they stopped throwing them and I haven't seen them since. This, in no way, is me saying their balls are not good but I'm just thinking in the sense of a pro shop owner, what's the incentive? What can I say about LF to sell to my customers? What makes their High Performance Piece as good or better than Radical, DV8, Storm/Roto, etc. What midpoint ball is going to de-throne the Hyroad Pearl, Deranged, Torrid Affair, etc? What Low End is going to be more of a "bang for your buck" than the Wrecker, 300C Solid, etc... These are questions that need to be addressed and advertised before I can honestly tell a customer this ball is going to be better than what you know and see everyday.
I can only go by what I've experienced through AMF/Global. I've loved a lot of the AMF/Global including some of the new releases, but have had to replace multiples and repair cracking in almost all of my AMF/Globals and done so in some of the equipment I've drilled for others. I've not had many people run throught the shop with Seismic so the only things I can report on is what I see on the lanes. I've been impressed with most of their releases but notice through weight holes that they share the same common shell thickness. I hope they do not share the same common traits as I love trying new companies on the lanes. Storm has gotten cheap in some of their high performance pieces, However, I've never drilled any Storm or Roto with 1/4" shell. That's not to say they don't exist but I've never drilled one.
I have really stopped throwing Motiv's for fear of their logo separations that I've noticed in almost all my Motiv balls over time. They make some great equipment for guys like me who need the ball to start up and roll heavy. However, I'm not going to wait for the logo to crack out (hopefully within a year) for them to honor the warranty and replace it.
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Just to make a correction, Motiv is currently PBA registered. Staffer Jake Peters won the PBA Badger Open this past summer.
The main issue with any start-up is exposure. Print media is going away (BTM) so what other traditional methods can companies use to get the bowler's attention? There is Facebook, but you have to already either like the company or know someone who does to get videos and marketing material. Internet via sites like this including YouTube, but if you don't know what you are looking for you will never find new up-and-coming companies.
The best way to introduce new companies is for pro-shops to carry them. The pro-shop is the largest influence to the customer's choice of a bowling ball. And when you have so many of the pro-shops mainly focused on one brand, you lose the chance to have new products introduced. One of my hobbies is brewing beer and I really like craft brew. But since the distributors in our state have such power, up and coming breweries can't even get shelf space to show off their product because of the big brewers dominating the cooler. Such is the predicament when the seller is in cahoots with one producer.
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I measured my cover thickness from both of my Long Horns to the cover thickness of my fiancée s Defiant Soul they are almost identical.
As far as Seismic, after I read all of the the "thickness of cover" concerns, I went and measure my Blackout, Dominion, Venator and Platinum, all three were slightly under 1/2 inch and I mean slightly. I also measure my Nomad, Defiant Soul and Nano. The Nano was at 1/2 exactly and the others were slightly under. So I don't see Seismic having those issues. My Blackout has at least 150 games on it and it performs as new. Ive been incredibly impressed with the Seismic equipment, yes the Venator is condition specific for me, but all of the others I have owned have been absolutely some of the best I have ever thrown. The Blackout is in the top two!! The Platinum is also climbing the list quickly.
I am not on any staff, I dont know much about LF, but I can say that if Seismic continues and markets the balls better they will make it and grow!
Motiv has a great following and some great stuff and will continue to grow. Their new releases are excellent!
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No big cracking issues or dying issues by any Seismic ball that I have thrown or sold. In four or five years of throwing Seismic and representing Seismic. I've had more balls crack and replaced from other name brands, than I've had Seismic. Doesn't mean it was because of shell thickness(which Seismic is comparable to other top brands), or that one cover is better than the other in my opinion, because I am more practical, and understand that sometimes shit happens. The majority of the time cracking is caused by too much glue, dull bit, or drilled too fast. And all that can happen on any manufacturers ball.
Balls crack for many reasons, sometimes for no rhyme or reason or how, when and why. I've had a Storm and Brunswick ball crack while drilling, does it mean they suck? In my opinion no. Shit happens when things are mass produced, it's part of the process and a part of life. Does it suck that it happens? Sure it does, that's why companies have good or bad customer service. We've all had bad luck with a product in some way, shape or form. Whether it be from a bowling ball or smart phones. And we all know there's always problems with smart phones.
As far as performance issues, every bit as good as the other guys. They take surface adjustments well, and cover the whole hooking spectrum from short patterns to long ones. Work very well on your house shots, and excellent on the sport patterns. Very comparable to top brands.
As for longevity, I have almost 400 games on my Blackout. It's my second one, my first had over 500 games on it. My Aftermath, has almost 400 games on it, 75% of those games are from tournaments. Has been resurfaced numerous times, as a matter of fact it was just resurfaced yesterday, as I have a tournament this weekend. I've had the Aftermath at many different surfaces, from extreme dull, to highly polished and it still performs the same. Same with my other Seismic equipment, as I feel surface plays the best role in ball motion. I always change the surface of a ball to fine tune the motion I want to see out of it. Again, very comparable to top brands in this category.
Dying issues, or balls not performing are more often the case of using the wrong ball for the wrong reasons. You know, "get the strongest ball out and try to throw it on a house shot type of reasons." Or wrong layouts because the shop operator didn't bother to fulfill his duty of getting bowlers specs and putting the proper layout on the correct ball. As far as myself, I haven't had any issues with Seismic balls "dying" after prolong use. On par with other top brands.
Now whether these smaller companies will survive the long run or not, solely depends on how the company and representatives take care of their customer base. Yes, the product has to perform as "advertised", and appeal to the bowlers, but the strength is from the foundation of the company and the people behind it. In my opinion, and from talks with Ryan Press, Seismic is doing pretty darn good.
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Well just for shits and giggles i decided to measure some of my equipment. I measured a 900 global protocol., missing link and look. Also an Amf incinerate , roto grip shatter, brunswick revolver and a hammer cobalt vibe. All shells were right on the 1/2 inch mark even 900 global/amf. Dont know where people are seeing 1/4 shells on global/amf equipment but it must be the older stuff cause it aint on mine. No cracks or defects on any balls.
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ok so lets talk about lane 1 how long do you think they have to go......nobodys been on here drinking the kool-aid in a long while...a remeber couple years ago there use to be long heat debates over this company on here....its was funny to read...
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I just purchased a special edition cherry SOS. Basically and SOS rerelease. Best dry lane ball I've ever thrown. Bar None. But they really need some new core technology.
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i agree they need new core tech....when they had momentum early on they didn't capitalize on it enough...so a new core new advertising...dont think their a bad company at all...more like stale company they need to do something exciting..... get people drinking the kool-aid again....only i ever owned by the was tsunami to much ball for me it hook and seem like it would hook again...weird i know that's best way to describe the reaction i had...i almost bought pink panther ball pro shop talked me out of it....pink panther idea thought was good but not much in my eyes to get excited about since then...I'm actually thinking next like try motiv or lordfield? minds not made up so who knows till then...
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l live in the DC Metro area of the country. I only hear about Lordfield and Seismic on this site. I know of no one who throws either of these company's products. Maybe they will extend their marketing to include the east coast eventually.
Right now Motiv is the schiznit on the east coast! I only see them getting better! That Primal red/orange ball is an absolute winner in this neck of the woods. I have seen a lot of people scoring and scoring well with that piece. Their new dry lane Tribal should bring a lot of interest to the masses.
As far as Lane 1 goes, they are behind the times. I see a lot of their new releases, but nothing that wows me, or peaks my interest. As others have said, I think they road that "one train" a little too long. I only know of one staffer in this area. A very good bowler, who makes their equipment look good, but not good enough to make me interested. I have a teammate who throws only Lane 1, also. I am not impressed. I have Roto equipment that will give me a variety of looks on tougher conditions, and carry better. In my opinion they are on their downward slide, but time will tell.
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I will have to agree with Jesse about Lane 1 Equipment and riding that one same train too long. Seems almost all of their cores are almost the same as the past with minor tweaks too small to notice. I rarely see anyone throwing a Lane 1 ball where I bowl. I see one lady throwing Lane 1 and that is about it. She still buys a new Lane 1 ball now and then and always ends up going home and putting it into the closet and going back to her old Brunswick made Lane 1 ball that she has always liked.
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See lots of Motiv thrown around here lately because I think one of the local pro shop owners really likes it and keeps it on the shelves. Lane 1 I've never seen nor Seismic, Global 900, Lord Field and AMF is pretty much non-existant now too.
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As far as Lane 1 goes, they are behind the times. I see a lot of their new releases, but nothing that wows me, or peaks my interest. As others have said, I think they road that "one train" a little too long.
I don't know how accurate this is. I booked my highest league average ever using Lane#1 90% of the time last year. For the most part, their equipment is even rolling and predictable. The fact that they use variations of the diamond doesn't make them any more "one train" than Columbia using the Momentum core in ball after ball.
For whatever reason, Lane#1 seems to have retrenched. They don't have the broader line-up or the marketing that they used to. Their technical information is limited on their cover-stocks and finishing processes. Many things seemed to have gone into a black hole since they went with 900Global for their production.
I've been migrating to Motiv because they seem to have the commitment Lane#1 used to possess, and Motiv's equipment has many of the same roll characteristics as Lane#1. The icing on the cake is that Motiv is PBA registered, and I'll be doing more of those tournaments moving forward. Things go in cycles. Hopefully they'll turn things around.
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The Droid and Stealth Bomber balls cores were a definite departure from Lane#1 usual design. I was not crazy about either Stealth as I never see enough oil to use them however the Droids were great with The Pearl Droid being one of my all time favorites and probably the hardest hitting ball I have ever thrown.
Seismic has a terrific lineup covering everything you will ever run up against in tournament competition. Anyone who doesn't try them are really missing out on some great gear. The Solaris Blackout and Solaris Platinum are quite possibly the best 1-2 punch available for a THS.
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l live in the DC Metro area of the country. I only hear about Lordfield and Seismic on this site. I know of no one who throws either of these company's products. Maybe they will extend their marketing to include the east coast eventually.]
Look up Sean Friendly he is the Seismic rep in the DC metro area. His email is seismicsean9@gmail.com. His home center is in Manasses, VA. Or if your real interested in Seismic you can PM me or gunny on here and we could get you more info or drop ship balls right to your door.
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As far as Lane 1 goes, they are behind the times. I see a lot of their new releases, but nothing that wows me, or peaks my interest. As others have said, I think they road that "one train" a little too long.
I don't know how accurate this is. I booked my highest league average ever using Lane#1 90% of the time last year. For the most part, their equipment is even rolling and predictable. The fact that they use variations of the diamond doesn't make them any more "one train" than Columbia using the Momentum core in ball after ball.
For whatever reason, Lane#1 seems to have retrenched. They don't have the broader line-up or the marketing that they used to. Their technical information is limited on their cover-stocks and finishing processes. Many things seemed to have gone into a black hole since they went with 900Global for their production.
I've been migrating to Motiv because they seem to have the commitment Lane#1 used to possess, and Motiv's equipment has many of the same roll characteristics as Lane#1. The icing on the cake is that Motiv is PBA registered, and I'll be doing more of those tournaments moving forward. Things go in cycles. Hopefully they'll turn things around.
Steven, I could be wrong in saying this, but it seems to me that Lane 1 started a long gradual slide backwards, the day Chuck left there. The slide was so slow that it took until this past year or so for it to be noticeable and even more noticeable now.
There was a time that no company could top them for customer service. Now they are close to if not at the bottom of all companies. I found out it was even worse than I thought when I began contacting companies about their 12# balls. Every company I Emailed responded within 4-12 hrs. One even on a weekend twice. After a week, I still never got any response from Lane 1 and finally had to contact a person a Lane 1 fan told me to try and even then I found out they had nothing to offer me in their newer balls of the past year.
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l live in the DC Metro area of the country. I only hear about Lordfield and Seismic on this site. I know of no one who throws either of these company's products. Maybe they will extend their marketing to include the east coast eventually.]
Look up Sean Friendly he is the Seismic rep in the DC metro area. His email is seismicsean9@gmail.com. His home center is in Manasses, VA. Or if your real interested in Seismic you can PM me or gunny on here and we could get you more info or drop ship balls right to your door.
Wow! Thanks Jason. I personally know Sean, as I have bowled both with him and against him in league play. I will definitely give him a shout. Thanks again.
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ok so lets talk about lane 1 how long do you think they have to go......nobodys been on here drinking the kool-aid in a long while...a remeber couple years ago there use to be long heat debates over this company on here....its was funny to read...
I like Lane #1. Some companies are bigger than others. Apparently, slappies for Elite hang out on these forums, and I don't see what's so special about their balls in comparison with Lane #1. The reaction I get with my Pink Panther is awesome, and I'm definitely interested in the Grind and Crank. I'm also interested in Elite, but I'm not buying a NIB $200 piece.
Oh, and on the subject of Motiv, I really like them. They've established themselves as a powerhouse in the market, and their releases look great and win tournaments.
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Lord Field is making some headway in the marketing world, there is more great equipment to come. To answer your question off the chain is comparable to a mid performance ball, Judjment is comparable to totally defiant and low end exodus series is a two piece ball that will not absorb oil so therefor the ball will never die or loose its hitting power. there equipment rolls great as soon as I get a moment I will post a video of the Torment which will give you great length and good backend. There is equipment in our line that is great for all bowling styles, great part about particle is it does great with surface change with no sacrafice in performance.