Author Topic: should these types avoid IT system? (Read 7306 times)

xrayjay · « **on:** April 08, 2014, 02:46:07 PM »

Those that roll over their thumb holes or have a tendancy to crack the area around the thumb slug, should they avoid using IT?

I tend to crack/damage thumb holes on spare balls throwing end over end. And at least one strike ball in the past. Likewise, I've also tried without a slug but my thumb gets really tacky really fast - even though i have semi to very dry hands.

I like working out my thumb holes to shape/fit with urethanes slugs. but with the IT systems and alike systems being around for a while now, I'm pretty sure they have imporved on these systems.

I remember guys with broken slug IT that came off during league, or cracked "molly"?? or ball it. Or the IT thumb just comes off the ball..... And there are those with different colored, sized, or angled IT thumbs which I think can get confusing. Or just adds more weight and space to the already heavy packed bag.

Should I go for it? and use a slug for a the poly ball only?

Gizmo823 · « **Reply #16 on:** April 09, 2014, 11:45:27 AM »

When you bowl as many games as they do as frequently as they do, stuff is just gonna happen . . but I'm not a big fan of Duke's fit. A lot of the "old school" guys stick with what they know. Duke has forward in his fingers and his span is too long which puts more pressure on his thumb. But if you only bowl league a couple times a week and even a tournament every weekend, no reason for you to need 4 or 5 slugs . . a couple pieces of tape here or there on occasion are all you should need.

Lol and while we're at it, I'm not a fan of the Vise tape that people put on the back of their thumbs! If your span is the right length and you aren't gripping you shouldn't need it to protect your thumb anyway, I can see if people would rather use it than tape in the actual ball, but if you're putting it on your thumb to keep from tearing it up . . tsk tsk . .

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:04:44 AM

Funny, I would think that guys like Norm Duke and Wes Malott would be able to find a competent driller who could give them a proper fit instead of fiddling with all that tape we see them using on TV.

milorafferty · « **Reply #17 on:** April 09, 2014, 11:54:40 AM »

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 11:45:27 AM

When you bowl as many games as they do as frequently as they do, stuff is just gonna happen . . but I'm not a big fan of Duke's fit. A lot of the "old school" guys stick with what they know. Duke has forward in his fingers and his span is too long which puts more pressure on his thumb. But if you only bowl league a couple times a week and even a tournament every weekend, no reason for you to need 4 or 5 slugs . . a couple pieces of tape here or there on occasion are all you should need.

Lol and while we're at it, I'm not a fan of the Vise tape that people put on the back of their thumbs! If your span is the right length and you aren't gripping you shouldn't need it to protect your thumb anyway, I can see if people would rather use it than tape in the actual ball, but if you're putting it on your thumb to keep from tearing it up . . tsk tsk . .

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:04:44 AM
Funny, I would think that guys like Norm Duke and Wes Malott would be able to find a competent driller who could give them a proper fit instead of fiddling with all that tape we see them using on TV.

I actually use the Vise Hada tape(Usually Red) on the back of my thumb. Proper fit has nothing to do with the reason I use it though.
It gives a consistent release every time, year round. It can be humid, dry or in between. Hot, cold it doesn't matter, my thumb comes out of the ball exactly the same way every time. A thumb slug(not to mention a slug-less hole) just can't do that. If I want a quicker or slower release, I can change to a different tape with the appropriate friction properties.

Tape is just another tool, it can be used improperly or for the purpose it was designed.

Gizmo823 · « **Reply #18 on:** April 09, 2014, 12:08:36 PM »

And that's perfectly reasonable. I use a couple pieces of white on the front to number one prevent suction, and also to have a little texture to help keep me from gripping. Just see way too many people with popped blood vessels near their cuticles, rubbing the back of their thumb knuckle raw that run in to buy the tape so they can keep gripping without tearing their thumb up . . lol pet peeve!

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:54:40 AM

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 11:45:27 AM
When you bowl as many games as they do as frequently as they do, stuff is just gonna happen . . but I'm not a big fan of Duke's fit. A lot of the "old school" guys stick with what they know. Duke has forward in his fingers and his span is too long which puts more pressure on his thumb. But if you only bowl league a couple times a week and even a tournament every weekend, no reason for you to need 4 or 5 slugs . . a couple pieces of tape here or there on occasion are all you should need.

Lol and while we're at it, I'm not a fan of the Vise tape that people put on the back of their thumbs! If your span is the right length and you aren't gripping you shouldn't need it to protect your thumb anyway, I can see if people would rather use it than tape in the actual ball, but if you're putting it on your thumb to keep from tearing it up . . tsk tsk . .

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:04:44 AM
Funny, I would think that guys like Norm Duke and Wes Malott would be able to find a competent driller who could give them a proper fit instead of fiddling with all that tape we see them using on TV.

I actually use the Vise Hada tape(Usually Red) on the back of my thumb. Proper fit has nothing to do with the reason I use it though.
It gives a consistent release every time, year round. It can be humid, dry or in between. Hot, cold it doesn't matter, my thumb comes out of the ball exactly the same way every time. A thumb slug(not to mention a slug-less hole) just can't do that. If I want a quicker or slower release, I can change to a different tape with the appropriate friction properties.

Tape is just another tool, it can be used improperly or for the purpose it was designed.

Stan · « **Reply #19 on:** April 09, 2014, 12:15:43 PM »

Everyone uses tape, all kinds of tape, it is not a bandaid for a bad fit. Why ? because we are all different and some skin is more sensitive than others. Moist skin, dry skin whatever, we are different. Like I said earlier, we are all striving for the perfect feel and we all have our little trick to accomplish it.

Norm Duke has never been in my shop and I never checked his span to see it its right or wrong, but he has been making a very good living with a bowling ball since he was a teenager so who in their right mind is going to tell him he has a bad fit ?

I drill for folks that their thumb never changes and some do not use tape, while others are always adjusting their thumb based on the climate and number of games bowled. NO, this is not a BAD FIT, just bowlers trying to maintain that perfect feel. Everybody is different.

milorafferty · « **Reply #20 on:** April 09, 2014, 12:35:30 PM »

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 12:08:36 PM

And that's perfectly reasonable. I use a couple pieces of white on the front to number one prevent suction, and also to have a little texture to help keep me from gripping. Just see way too many people with popped blood vessels near their cuticles, rubbing the back of their thumb knuckle raw that run in to buy the tape so they can keep gripping without tearing their thumb up . . lol pet peeve!

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:54:40 AM
Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 11:45:27 AM
When you bowl as many games as they do as frequently as they do, stuff is just gonna happen . . but I'm not a big fan of Duke's fit. A lot of the "old school" guys stick with what they know. Duke has forward in his fingers and his span is too long which puts more pressure on his thumb. But if you only bowl league a couple times a week and even a tournament every weekend, no reason for you to need 4 or 5 slugs . . a couple pieces of tape here or there on occasion are all you should need.

Lol and while we're at it, I'm not a fan of the Vise tape that people put on the back of their thumbs! If your span is the right length and you aren't gripping you shouldn't need it to protect your thumb anyway, I can see if people would rather use it than tape in the actual ball, but if you're putting it on your thumb to keep from tearing it up . . tsk tsk . .

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:04:44 AM
Funny, I would think that guys like Norm Duke and Wes Malott would be able to find a competent driller who could give them a proper fit instead of fiddling with all that tape we see them using on TV.

I actually use the Vise Hada tape(Usually Red) on the back of my thumb. Proper fit has nothing to do with the reason I use it though.
It gives a consistent release every time, year round. It can be humid, dry or in between. Hot, cold it doesn't matter, my thumb comes out of the ball exactly the same way every time. A thumb slug(not to mention a slug-less hole) just can't do that. If I want a quicker or slower release, I can change to a different tape with the appropriate friction properties.

Tape is just another tool, it can be used improperly or for the purpose it was designed.

Here is a tip for you if you use tape to prevent suction. This applies to the Vise IT with the Vise Slugs with the rib in the back. Drill a very small hole in the slug near the IT base, suction problem solved.

Gizmo823 · « **Reply #21 on:** April 09, 2014, 01:27:48 PM »

Yeap, already do it. Definitely a good suggestion!

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 12:35:30 PM

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 12:08:36 PM
And that's perfectly reasonable. I use a couple pieces of white on the front to number one prevent suction, and also to have a little texture to help keep me from gripping. Just see way too many people with popped blood vessels near their cuticles, rubbing the back of their thumb knuckle raw that run in to buy the tape so they can keep gripping without tearing their thumb up . . lol pet peeve!

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:54:40 AM
Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 11:45:27 AM
When you bowl as many games as they do as frequently as they do, stuff is just gonna happen . . but I'm not a big fan of Duke's fit. A lot of the "old school" guys stick with what they know. Duke has forward in his fingers and his span is too long which puts more pressure on his thumb. But if you only bowl league a couple times a week and even a tournament every weekend, no reason for you to need 4 or 5 slugs . . a couple pieces of tape here or there on occasion are all you should need.

Lol and while we're at it, I'm not a fan of the Vise tape that people put on the back of their thumbs! If your span is the right length and you aren't gripping you shouldn't need it to protect your thumb anyway, I can see if people would rather use it than tape in the actual ball, but if you're putting it on your thumb to keep from tearing it up . . tsk tsk . .

Quote from: milorafferty on April 09, 2014, 11:04:44 AM
Funny, I would think that guys like Norm Duke and Wes Malott would be able to find a competent driller who could give them a proper fit instead of fiddling with all that tape we see them using on TV.

I actually use the Vise Hada tape(Usually Red) on the back of my thumb. Proper fit has nothing to do with the reason I use it though.
It gives a consistent release every time, year round. It can be humid, dry or in between. Hot, cold it doesn't matter, my thumb comes out of the ball exactly the same way every time. A thumb slug(not to mention a slug-less hole) just can't do that. If I want a quicker or slower release, I can change to a different tape with the appropriate friction properties.

Tape is just another tool, it can be used improperly or for the purpose it was designed.

Here is a tip for you if you use tape to prevent suction. This applies to the Vise IT with the Vise Slugs with the rib in the back. Drill a very small hole in the slug near the IT base, suction problem solved.

xrayjay · « **Reply #22 on:** April 09, 2014, 01:38:46 PM »

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 09, 2014, 11:36:54 AM

Yeah, the smaller your thumb, the easier it is to do, but the "correct" way is to drill the pitch into the ball, and just drill the slug itself at 0, BUT it does give you some flexibility to experiment or try some things with different pitches pretty easily.

Quote from: Stan on April 09, 2014, 11:27:20 AM
Normally the slug is drilled at zero and the pitch is in the ball. You can alter the pitch when you drill a new IT but you have to be sure the drill will not go thru the sides of the slug. Example, if you ball already has 1/8 reverse and 0 lateral and you want to try 0 reverse and 1/8 lateral, you would drill the slug 1/8 forward and 1/8 lateral. This pitch will offset whats in the ball and the result is what you wanted. Again, this is mostly for experiments.

That makes sense...

Joe Cool · « **Reply #23 on:** April 09, 2014, 01:44:13 PM »

The driller where I live drills the holes to zero and the pitch in the slug so people can try out other people's bowling balls. obviously spans are a bit different, but you can usually at least see what a ball/drilling will or won't do for you.

That said, I'm not sure that's the ideal way to do it for the individual, but there are benefits to the group.

xrayjay · « **Reply #24 on:** April 09, 2014, 01:50:04 PM »

I use carpet tape and white tape up front. And when I bowled a lot, leagues or tourneys, the back of my thumb turned dark and rough from the friction. It wasn't pretty that's for sure, but at least it's not a Roth thumb.

I've used tape of all types. Vise red, grey, & black; roll of white & black; frank'n tape; and electrical tape

but the carpet tape still gives me that ability to come out of the ball on time. I really like the feel of a very snug thumb, and the CT provides that. It's just rough on my skin.

Gizmo823 · « **Reply #25 on:** April 09, 2014, 01:58:34 PM »

*Facepalm* Actually that's a genius marketing ploy . . but one that takes advantage of ignorance . .

Quote from: Joe Cool on April 09, 2014, 01:44:13 PM

The driller where I live drills the holes to zero and the pitch in the slug so people can try out other people's bowling balls. obviously spans are a bit different, but you can usually at least see what a ball/drilling will or won't do for you.

That said, I'm not sure that's the ideal way to do it for the individual, but there are benefits to the group.

xrayjay · « **Reply #26 on:** April 09, 2014, 02:02:02 PM »

Quote from: Joe Cool on April 09, 2014, 01:44:13 PM

The driller where I live drills the holes to zero and the pitch in the slug so people can try out other people's bowling balls. obviously spans are a bit different, but you can usually at least see what a ball/drilling will or won't do for you.

That said, I'm not sure that's the ideal way to do it for the individual, but there are benefits to the group.

whao....really? I don't nobody touching my ba....equipment

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #27 on:** April 09, 2014, 03:23:56 PM »

Joe Cool and Stan,

Thanks for your answers!

I conceptualize that it can be done. My local ball driller puts the slug in a special ball with an anchor(my name in the bottom of the thumb hole to drill his Inner slug). He was not sure if they allowed much variation off of 0 or much drilling off center as maybe it could damage the anchor.

I assume from your answers that damage from drilling pitches off of 0 for the inner slug or off center for that slug.

It seems that doing as stated by Joe Cool is very standard, one must only be careful to not introduce too much pitch that the thumbhole penetrates the side of the slug based on the comments in this thread.

Regards,

Luckylefty

storm making it rain · « **Reply #28 on:** April 10, 2014, 09:03:45 AM »

You can't fit that much pitch in a thumb slug if you don't drill the pitch into the ball. The average adult male's thumb size is probably somewhere between 29/32 and 1" (and most likely some oval angles). So the most you'll fit is maybe 1/4 (if that) either way even using a 1 3/8 size IT. And let's say you drill one ball with the pitch into the ball and the next ball with the pitch into the thumb, that slug won't be flush in both balls.

But anyhow, I've started to go away with the IT system, as i've seen hoards of them breaking lately. Seems to me that the quality has gone down as my first IT slug I drilled for myself (5 years ago roughly) lasted forever, and now they seem to be breaking all over the place (in different parts of the system) for my customers.

Gizmo823 · « **Reply #29 on:** April 10, 2014, 02:37:13 PM »

Has the plastic been fracturing or breaking, or just a lot of stuff coming unglued?

Quote from: storm making it rain on April 10, 2014, 09:03:45 AM

You can't fit that much pitch in a thumb slug if you don't drill the pitch into the ball. The average adult male's thumb size is probably somewhere between 29/32 and 1" (and most likely some oval angles). So the most you'll fit is maybe 1/4 (if that) either way even using a 1 3/8 size IT. And let's say you drill one ball with the pitch into the ball and the next ball with the pitch into the thumb, that slug won't be flush in both balls.

But anyhow, I've started to go away with the IT system, as i've seen hoards of them breaking lately. Seems to me that the quality has gone down as my first IT slug I drilled for myself (5 years ago roughly) lasted forever, and now they seem to be breaking all over the place (in different parts of the system) for my customers.

storm making it rain · « **Reply #30 on:** April 10, 2014, 02:44:29 PM »

I've seen a little of everything. Most of the time it's the Ball-IT and Slug IT plastic that breaks. Once in a while I get the Slug-IT jumping over the stopper which makes it just keep spinning. I'm not entirely sure it's not the bowlers somehow making these things happen, because I've only personally had 2 slug it's or ball it's break on me in the 4-6 years i've used the system. But i've recently personally stopped using them anyway and went back to regular slugs.

Quote from: Gizmo823 on April 10, 2014, 02:37:13 PM

Has the plastic been fracturing or breaking, or just a lot of stuff coming unglued?

Quote from: storm making it rain on April 10, 2014, 09:03:45 AM
You can't fit that much pitch in a thumb slug if you don't drill the pitch into the ball. The average adult male's thumb size is probably somewhere between 29/32 and 1" (and most likely some oval angles). So the most you'll fit is maybe 1/4 (if that) either way even using a 1 3/8 size IT. And let's say you drill one ball with the pitch into the ball and the next ball with the pitch into the thumb, that slug won't be flush in both balls.

But anyhow, I've started to go away with the IT system, as i've seen hoards of them breaking lately. Seems to me that the quality has gone down as my first IT slug I drilled for myself (5 years ago roughly) lasted forever, and now they seem to be breaking all over the place (in different parts of the system) for my customers.

Author Topic: should these types avoid IT system? (Read 7306 times)

xrayjay

should these types avoid IT system?

Gizmo823

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milorafferty

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Gizmo823

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Stan

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milorafferty

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xrayjay

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Joe Cool

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xrayjay

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Gizmo823

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xrayjay

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LuckyLefty

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storm making it rain

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Gizmo823

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storm making it rain

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