BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: TheGom on October 21, 2012, 09:57:57 PM
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Seems that no one wants to tell me the pattern at this new house I am at. I asked the League Secretary, nothing. I asked the front desk, nothing. I asked the Pro Shop operator, nothing, and finally I asked the Lane Man as he was doing our lanes before league and all I got was "I do not know". I said, well lemons knows because they must program the Kegel machine. He tells m that the morning person does that.
Is it wrong t ask wat the pattern is? I am trying t learn how to pay different shots and it would be nice apply the 31 rule based on some info and study the pattern online.
Thoughts?
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You might be surprised to find how clueless a lot of bowling alley employees are. One of the three houses I bowl is exactly as you describe.
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I don't think it should be a secret but I understand why they wouldn't want to tell you or anyone. When you work in a bowling center, you get enough "constructive criticism" about the "shot." Give some people additional information and it will only provide for additional fuel for complaint.
As a bowler, I hear enough complaints when I bowl sport leagues. This doesn't play like [insert pattern name here]. I usually mumble these same kinds of things to myself right before I fry. :)
And in some cases, Milo is right. The laneman just pushes the buttons and has no idea what he's putting down.
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As riggs would say. Someone knows and if someone knows and that person is also a league bowler he/she has one hand up on everyone else. Post it at the front counter for all to see. Nothing to hide.
Though, I will say since majority of house shots are wet/dry house shots and high ratio's middle to outside it shouldn't be that difficult to find an area of the lane to strike at will.
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If its anything like ours, it changes week to week.....i.e., a jet is clogged on the lane machine, it runs out of stripper soln/oil by thy time it makes it to the end of the house, or there has been two hours of open bowling on the lanes prior to league.
You may be bettter off not knowing in this case, and just playing what the lane gives that particular evening...
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On a THS, your ball will tell you enough. I agree with the post by S^S that the machine may not be staying reliable as the pattern is, so you find yourself trying out play the pattern on the sheet, not on the lane.
Also, how many house bowlers will actually be able to tell you what the sheet actually says? Heck, I have a hard time with it.
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Some good info and things to take into consideration.
I am mainly after the length to start working with the 31 rule. The first three weeks it seemed very short compared to the house I came from. Of course my baseline ball did not work well and I had to adjust. I was really after the pattern to look at a better match up ball wise and how to drill it and to learn the exit point. Rumor was it was a 35 foot Kegel Winding Road which is a Sport Pattern it seems, yet we were not a Port League. All the new teams that came over averages dropped 10-30 pins and the league average was about 171 for the first three weeks. Was told it was not a Sport shot, but a harder THS. Of course our team suffered big time till the 4 week when the new averages were set. Now they changed the pattern to a much easier shot which I was told that they added length and walled it up some.
I am just trying to learn more about Patterns and see if I can put two and two together by seeing them on paper, using the 31 rule, Reverse Oil rule that I just learned about in my other thread, and taking those to the lanes.
It would be nice to have a starting reference even though it all changes quickly or varies from lane to lane, week to week.
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To apply the 31 rule all you need is the length. Try asking how long the pattern is and not "what's the oil pattern?"
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I did, sorry if it came across that I did not. My question to them was simple, "what is the length of the pattern and what type of pattern is it" I understand it is two fold.
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There are numerous articles that detail how to figure out where the oil is and how long it is. I believe Wes Mallot was featured in a ABC magazine article a few years ago. If the lanes have range finders on them 40 ft down it is fairly easy to watch a few balls and see where they start to hook. 31 rule is cool but what your ball and eyes tell you is where you need to play the lanes.
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Yes, I learned about range finders at a IAB boot camp, Probelm is no range finders at this house, but thanks!
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Personally as much as I like the 31 rule, I don't know if it really matters on a house shot. People can play break points from 1 to 17 on a house shot and still get to the pocket and score high.
I think it matters a lot more on a flatter patterns where missing your breakpoint will often result in a bad shot .... but perhaps your house shot is flatter than some.
I have had similar complaints about the centers I bowl at as well. Most proprietors treat the pattern details about as secretive as plans to build a nuclear bomb. Our biggest league in town has two center employees in it, and they set the shot. One of them has the highest average in the league. Not that he isn't a good bowler, but still, it just seems wrong to me.
I stopped bowling in one monthly tournament in town because some people knew the shot (friends with the center employees), and others didn't. I would ask the people running the tournament and would get "I can't tell you", as the response. So I just quit bowling in it.
Just my 3 cents.
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If bowling a league, then it shouldn't matter as long as the shot stays somewhat consistent (discounting normal seasonal changes such as humidity levels). Within a couple of league sessions you should be able to find the shot as if you had the pattern in front of you. If your ability isn't at the level to find the shot within 6 games, then knowing the pattern/length isn't going to help you anyway.
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All great points and understood about "the league bowler"
Just trying to sharpen my skills some by learning more about lanes and patterns, be it a THS...because there are many different ones or harder patterns. Always looking to improve.
Thanks for all the thoughts and help!
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Personally, IMHO, USBC had a good thing when they announced the Red, White and Blue Patterns, designing certain patterns for all alleys to try and see which will work best. USBC decided for some reason to make the house shot the Red pattern, and that took out the Blue and White out of play.
Because of this, league bowling has become a joke and only the employees (mainly mechanic and manager) have the edge over all bowlers (assuming there are no pro bowlers in your league). If USBC would come up a pattern for the Red, and told all alleys they must use one of the three in order to comply with USBC, bowling leagues in my mind would be fair again.
The sport has gotten so technical, I firmly believe the bowler has the right to know what pattern is out there so they can decided what their next purchase of equipment is.
So to answer the question, the league shot should NOT be a secret.
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But how long do they have that edge? If it's a league, then not long enough for it to matter in my opinion. I bowl a high level scratch league where the house mechanic is in the same league. The guy is a decent bowler, but is middle of the pack in this league at best. His team didn't even win their points the first week, so knowing the pattern only goes so far.
As I stated in a previous comment, if a league bowler can't find the shot within a couple of league sessions, then having the actual pattern information is not going to help him/her anyway.
Personally, IMHO, USBC had a good thing when they announced the Red, White and Blue Patterns, designing certain patterns for all alleys to try and see which will work best. USBC decided for some reason to make the house shot the Red pattern, and that took out the Blue and White out of play.
Because of this, league bowling has become a joke and only the employees (mainly mechanic and manager) have the edge over all bowlers (assuming there are no pro bowlers in your league). If USBC would come up a pattern for the Red, and told all alleys they must use one of the three in order to comply with USBC, bowling leagues in my mind would be fair again.
The sport has gotten so technical, I firmly believe the bowler has the right to know what pattern is out there so they can decided what their next purchase of equipment is.
So to answer the question, the league shot should NOT be a secret.
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Most people don't ask what the House Pattern is, but in my opinion if you ask you should get an answer! Why not post it at the control counter? To easy! In this day and age with bowling down, why not show some good customer service - make your bowler happy, just tell him what he is bowling on. After all he is paying good money every week. What really gets me is a lot of tournaments being run and they still won't tell you ! By the time you pay entry fees and side action your looking at we'll over $100.00. Just don't get it why everything is on the QT. If anyone gets any of my money, all I ask for is some answers or I don't play. House bowlers need to be taking care of! That's who's keeping the place open.
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I'm with Milo on this one. If you can't figure it out within a couple of weeks, bowling 3 games plus practice, a chart or lane graph isn't going to help you out. It's not like the majority of house shots are hard to figure out. Also, if you figure in that one side (low end) of the house may play totally different than the other side (high end) due to topography, and the inconsistancies of the normal bowlers release, I don't think it would make a difference in play.
You would be having guys taking the chart into their pro shop, showing them it, and saying "I want a ball that will work on that". Nevermind how you actually bowl. Here's the pattern. If you don't think so, think again.
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In this case it matters to him - end of discussion! He is paying to bowl - they are not paying him. You know just as we'll as I do that what's easy to figure out for one isn't easy for another! Some people walk in lined up. As far as drilling goes - your saying the length of the pattern and volume dosen't matter?
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I've bowled in a house that couldn't tell you for sure what the shot was. Mainly due to the equipment. They could tell you what they were trying for but that wasn't the end result.
It was a typical Christmas tree pattern except from the 7 board to the gutter on both sides was out of bounds. This would be the shot for a few months then the shot would go to a lighter oil pattern with out the out of bounds on the gutter. It would go back and forth for no reason.
Still if you asked what brand furniture polish they used to wax the synthetic approaches they would get that right every time. (the furniture polish was better then the powder they use to dump out, I will admit that) ahhhh do not miss bowling there.
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Wow are you kidding me! They seem more worried about taken care of the approaches than the lanes. Do you know why? Someone falls and gets hurt it cost their insurance company money.Both the lanes and approaches need TLC. How is their business doing? My guess its way down. If centers would end the season with what they started with, you would have happy bowlers coming back.
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Very serious. We live in a usually hot and always humid environment.(aka dirty south) What most centers do not take into consideration with synthetic approaches, as stated from the manufactures, is that your heating and cooling system needs to meet certain requirements in order for you to get the best results from the approaches.
Our center did not take that into consideration when built back in 2001ish and has had problems every since with the approaches being tacky whenever there is any kind of humidity.(almost daily) So due to bowlers complaining about the approaches the center started trying to fix the problems with band-aids.
Funny how bowlers buy these shoes that can change the heels and soles yet are too stupid and lazy to actually adjust their shows to the approaches.
So the center starts by using a push broom to apply powder on the approaches. Just dumps a pile at one end and pushes it down to the next. Only on the last 3-4 feet of the approaches. This last for several months with several people falling and eventually comes furniture polish and a buffer. (FYI look on any shoe manufactures website for heel or sole replacements that are recommended for powdered approaches or polished approaches)
This is now the current standard for how they dress their approaches. Both the powder and wax ware off during practice and the start of the first game. Until you move left for shooting at say a 10 pin and you hit a slick spot that hasn't been bowled on yet.
Needless to say the shot on the lanes isn't always the toughest thing to worry about.
The old oil machine crapped out and was replaced due to how different it was oiling from one lane to the next. Part of the problem is because of how out of wack the lanes are.
They don't meet USBC standards for how level they should be and there for in many places when the machine oils and stripes the lanes it actually doesn't touch parts of the lanes to do so. This was brought to my attention by the person that checks the lanes yearly. Since the center gets to keep picking lanes till one pair passes. They are still certified by USBC because they do not want to lose the money and the USBC will not have the house fix the several lanes out of compliance. That is you business 101.
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I just don't know what to say. Having been an lane man, night manager, pro shop tech. It seems to me they are in the wrong business
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Not every center has a Kegel Kustodian lane machine! We used a Century PC for years and it was a wick machine and wasn't very consistant! We've bought a Kegel Kustodian Ion a few years back and run a modified Stone Street pattern and I had somebody ask what pattern we ran and I told him. His response was, "what does that mean"? I ask him if he's ever bowled on any Kegel recreational patterns/ths and he said he didn't know what he's bowled on. I told him to play like a ths around 2nd arrow and just adjust right of left depending on the hook!
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I got to a tournament early, before they started the oiling. I asked the lane tech what the pattern was, and he said "Number 2". I asked him what it was and he said he didn't know. I just set it to number 2 and run the lanes.
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You should be able to tell the length of any pattern after you've thrown 3 or 4 balls on the fresh. I take it the lanes are oiled before league?
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its a freakin house shot.....how hard is it to figure out. no house shot is a secret. everyone is bowling on the same thing. not telling you the pattern at tournaments is so everyone is on the same playing feild and the better bowlers have a little reward because they can adjust better. in league there is a negligible advantage to those in the know
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It's a house shot....do you need an arsenal and graph to bowl on it? You should need about 5 shots in 3 minutes of practice to get an idea of where to start.
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Sorry but this thread is one of the cancers in bowling today...it's f'ing league people. Just put your shoes on and bowl.
Reality is if the lane man handed you a lane graph most of you wouldn't know the first thing about how to read it. All named patterns are doing is raising a new generation of idiots that can't bowl unless they have landing lights on the lane telling them where to play.
There is oil left and hook to the right....the rest is just details.
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...it's f'ing league people. Just put your shoes on and bowl.
Reality is if the lane man handed you a lane graph most of you wouldn't know the first thing about how to read it. All named patterns are doing is raising a new generation of idiots that can't bowl unless they have landing lights on the lane telling them where to play.
There is oil left and hook to the right....the rest is just details.
This!
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TheGom - It's not wrong to ask of the center that you pay your hard earned money some questions! If getting lined up were as easy as some people think it is, they would all average 240+ Myself being 55 years old my 1st 3 shots are not full speed. For me, the more I know about what I am bowling ahead of time, the better guess I make on where to start and go to when things change as they always do. So keep asking your questions-go up the chain of command or find someone that has good results there and talk to them, bowlers like to talk justlook above at the replies. Just weed out the idiots or the ones with cancer or f'ing league bowlers- HaHa
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I don't always use the 31 rule, but i still only care about buff length on a pattern.
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Actually sms getting lined up wouldn't mean everyone would average 240. Pretty sure there are lots of guys at home that know where the outside corner is on a baseball field, but don't have the talent to throw it over 68mph....
You need talent too....and yes....people horribly overthink house shots. It's a tophat...who gives a s**t about buff....or a -31 rule? You stand somewhere left of your breakpoint and throw it right. If you go face...your feet go left....and vice versa.