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Author Topic: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?  (Read 2500 times)

Raven829

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Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« on: February 21, 2005, 07:58:17 AM »
I have been thinking about making an appointment with Bill Spigner to get my game back on track.  I think I have the potential to be pretty good, but this year has been awful and has shattered my confidence.  Hawthorne is not exactly next door to me, and I'm pretty busy with school and work.  An hour is probably all I could manage at this time.  For those of you that have worked with wonderful coaches before, can an hour make an improvement in my game?

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Strike300

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #1 on: February 21, 2005, 04:21:21 PM »
In an hour he will be able to find out the major things in your game and show you how to correct them. I'd rather find a good local coach and work with them more often than a hour with one.

mumzie

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #2 on: February 21, 2005, 04:53:15 PM »
The question isn't whether the coach can spot the things wrong with your game and come up with a lesson plan for you to work from.

The question is - once you've met with the coach, and spent that hour, are you willing to put in the time practicing (not for score, but real work type practice) that it will take to fix what's wrong???
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digitard

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #3 on: February 21, 2005, 07:09:21 PM »
I've also been thinking about a coach.  When I was last REALLY into bowling (16-18) my average was pretty nice and I held my own, but I wasn't ever 'top of the list' material.

Now being 24 and getting back into the swing of things I've debated it.

I'd look more into the long term.  1hr with an amazing coach may allow him to find a few things, and give you sime feedback to improve it, but 5hrs with a good solid coach is going to improve your game a lot more in the long run since you'll be able to spot those mistakes, find a way to work on them, and adapt to a way that fits you best.

I think I'm also going to take some footage on my MiniDV of my general bowling and run it by some people on here, or online in general, to also get some feedback.

Raven829

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #4 on: February 21, 2005, 08:47:40 PM »
Mumzie-
   That is an excellent point you bring up.  When I posted, I thought it was assumed.  I already spend a lot of my time practicing, but I'm positive I'm not doing it right because the scores haven't gone up.  It's time to see someone who knows what they're talking about so I can start working on the things that need to be fixed.
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star

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #5 on: February 22, 2005, 04:53:56 AM »
You cannot fail to benifit from going to an "A" class coach.
When my coach lived in the UK it was unbelievable how I improved.
I went to see Tim Mack after my coach had left and Tim said I had a "terrific" game. He went through a couple of things, like wrist positions that would improve my game and take it to the next level.
I have since been working on them and I can see more improvement.
He asked me to attend his 3 day course this year if I get chance as working on the mental side of my game is where I will really make the big jump.
I will if he does make it over to the UK.
So if it were me I would definatly take the chance of visiting Bill Spigner, the comments he makes about your game will be invaluable.
I will make one suggestion to you and that is to take a mate along with you with a camcorder and get him to film the whole session, as I did. That way youve always got a record of what Bill wants you to work on.
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MSC2471

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #6 on: February 22, 2005, 07:20:12 AM »
Based on my personal game, I've benefitted more from going to the same coach for 5 hours of practice (1 hour sessions each time) than I would with 1 hour from a famous coach. I've been able to put the things we've worked on into focus during practice sessions, league play and tournament play- as a result seeing my timing improve, my power on my release much better and I feel like I have more confidence in different parts of my game that before I would have no clue how to improve upon.

Matt

seadrive

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #7 on: February 22, 2005, 08:05:40 AM »
You hear stories of a bowler getting "fixed" overnight by a great coach, but that's mostly high-level guys like Danny Wiseman, and the fix is usually quite minor.

For we mere mortals, I think you're much better off finding a good local coach, and working with him or her as often as you can afford.

There's nothing wrong with taking a lesson from a great coach, or going to a 1-3 day clinic, but don't expect miracles overnight.  Because of the way we learn, it's usually a "two steps forward, one step back" process.  No matter how hard you try, you will usually revert to your old form and habits, without periodic retraining and reinforcement.

Trust me, I know whereof I speak.
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pin-chaser

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #8 on: February 22, 2005, 08:29:24 AM »
As always I take a different view.

Helping other as aften as I do, I find it completely amazing that students believe there is a magic cure to there current problems. But the fact is, there is always only one problem, everyone has it.. its always the same thing. It is why students seek instructors and it is not anything mechanical or physical. It is KNOWLEDGE. And the thing about knowledge is that anyone can learn it completely on there own if they are analytical in there game, if they search out books and articles. The information is there but instead, they search for an instructor that can magically provide answers and when the students get those answers they dont take the time to really understand those changes and convert the physical information into knowledge.

Example, a student comes to me and says.. I am bowling bad. I raise his pushaway, slow his feet down and suddenly he is bowling terrific. So now he goes off and understands that he bowls better if he does those things and he is happy. But, he did not take the time to learn about his timing, all the issues surrounding timing and there impacts and how to adjust his own timing in the future. And soon enough he is back with the same issues.

The point here is that, with video so cheap, books, internet (websites like this one and many others) and the dedication to becoming a real student of this sport, every bowler can teach themselves easier than seeing a coach. You know your game, you feel every shot you take everytime. The coach may see you for one hour every so often. It is difficult for coaches to see the big picture.

I think it is much more effecient to teach a man to fish, than to give a man a fish to eat. The man who knows how to fish will eat forever. The other man is hungry the next day.
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seadrive

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #9 on: February 22, 2005, 09:27:12 AM »
I guess Mark Baker was only able to fix Walter Ray's problem because WRW doesn't have enough knowledge of bowling, and the way he bowls, eh pin-chaser?

quote:
It is difficult for coaches to see the big picture.

It is difficult for the bowler to see the big picture, as he is the picture.  The number of things we all do physically on our way to the foul line are too numerous to be simultaneously evaluated in real time by the person performing the actions.
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pin-chaser

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #10 on: February 22, 2005, 01:38:07 PM »
seadive,

  granted. Hense my suggestion about obtaining video to do evaluations. All I am trying to say, is that your learning is your responsibility. There are many methods to do such. The one most obvious is doing everything in your own power to obtain it before seeking others help.
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ThongPrincess

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #11 on: February 22, 2005, 05:26:34 PM »
This is from personal experience.  I worked with one coach over the summer, about 5-10 lessons over the 3 month period and a few follow-ups over the last 2 years.  My bowling improved, but not to where I want it to be.

Early this month I worked with a Silver Certified coach and did the Bowler's MAP, total of 2 hrs.  He gave me a few things to work on and we have chatted about the progress.  The new changes are beginning to feel comfortable so last night I told him I wanted to schedule a follow up lesson.  So in the next week or so, we'll be meeting for a 1 hr session.

I doubt that he could have fixed everything in a 1 hr session and scheduling a few 1 hr sessions over time would probably be best.  Just my 2cents worth.
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Tenpinrufer

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #12 on: February 22, 2005, 05:33:23 PM »
It depends on what is wrong and at what point you are at. Last year I took an hour lesson, changed a few things and a week later I shot my two highest series ever, 783, & 760. I don't think that was a coincidence. Any lesson is better than no lesson at all. Pick a good coach. Listen to what he says and practice it hard. You will probably go down before you go back up, but when you go up it will be a marked difference!

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Tenpinrufer

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #13 on: February 22, 2005, 05:35:29 PM »
I just love the Thongpricess' name. I somehow envision bowling with her and be very happy! LOL. Have a sense of humor. I am only joking!

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ThongPrincess

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Re: Can just 1 hour with a great coach straighten me out?
« Reply #14 on: February 23, 2005, 03:17:41 AM »
LOL You obviously never heard the story of how I got my name.  But I won't ruin the fantasy
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