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Author Topic: Tournament TOAST!  (Read 1912 times)

JOE FALCO

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Tournament TOAST!
« on: May 24, 2004, 01:46:39 AM »
Did it again! Entered a tournament that was held by the SOUTHEAST BOWLING ASSOCIATION in RALEIGH NC. It was TEAM on Saturday and SINGLES/DOUBLES on Sunday. Two different Centers Buffaloe North and Buffaloe South. Signed up for the 12:30 afternoon squad for both sessions.

Sunday was at BUFFALOE NORTH. Get there about 12 in the afternoon and there are groups of three on a lane where they bowled Singles followed by Doubles! They finished at 1 PM (must of had some problems). As they were leaving we went right on the lanes and started our DOUBLES/SINGLES competition.

Can you imagine how the lane conditions were by the time we went to SINGLES? How do they get away with that? We always ask the question WHY are we losing tournament bowlers .. THAT'S WHY! I run into the same thing in my last tournament last month. They have seen the LAST OF ME! I love to bowl but I want an equal shot at bowling! I think it's terrible that this should be what we have to expect.

I posted last tournament and heard responses that led me to believe that this is EXPECTED! Scheduling is the reason for it! I believe that BOWLERS should REBEL .. let the schedules CHANGE .. give everyone an equal chance.

Is it TRUE that all tournament where singles and doubles are involved that there are TWO SESSIONS of S/D before they RE-OIL? If you respond please let me know what STATE you are from. Thanks!

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anotherwindup

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #1 on: May 24, 2004, 04:51:58 PM »
Yep, happened to me a couple years ago.  
Won't happen again, as we figured out the squad times and reoil times.  
We now bowl on FRESH in EVERY event.    

IL, here.  

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Belgarion

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2004, 05:00:32 PM »
I don't know about this year in PA (as I ran into fresh), but the last few years I am pretty sure it was every other squad for states.

I bowled another tournament was a 1 day tourny 5 games across 10 lanes.  They oil once total for 3 squads, so if you bowl late you are getting 3rd shift oil with what is sometimes 5 bowlers a lane.  They then cut the field to 16 and do match play.  So if you qualified in the morning, you get after 3rd shift oil to try to do match play, talk about a contrast.

I would love to see oil after every shift, but i think some of the issue is time.  Centers generally make more money from open bowlers and want to get the tournaments in and out as fast as possible so they can re-open for business

MSC2471

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #3 on: May 24, 2004, 11:41:03 PM »
Rock77 would know better than I may, but I believe for the MA state tournament there was fresh oil for the first squad each day, then the next shift would bowl, then they would re-oil for the third shift of the day. I know on the day I bowled there was oil for doubles/singles, then they had a team shift which bowled on those conditions before they re-oiled for the next doubles/singles shift.

Most tournaments seem to do this as they want to maximize the number of entries in the tournament and by re-oiling after every squad you could lose out on one extra squad per day (depending on the number of lanes in the house and the machine you use to oil the lanes).

Matt

Strider

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #4 on: May 24, 2004, 11:59:56 PM »
That's part of the reason we have/need arsenals.  On longer format tourneys, I've started with solid particle, and ended up throwing pearl urethane.  Like you said, there's hardly time to find time to reoil between team and singles/doubles.  Even if they wanted to reoil, they couldn't start until just about everyone was done.  There's always some slow bowlers, so there would be a huge break between squads.

Sounds like you ought to expect dryer lanes.  What low hooking balls do you own?  Maybe it's time to drop to a lower weight as well?
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MTFD24

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2004, 12:29:07 AM »
EVERY year in the NY State Fireman's Tournament (different house every year), we have imparity in oil by squads. Having bowled in this tournament for over a decade, I know what to expect.

Last year I ended up bowling 5 straight squads, 3 teams and 2 doubles, as I was being asked to fill in for one team or another. There was no "fresh oil" since squad 1. Why? Due to time, slow bowler's etc. etc.  The lanes had wanted to re-oil between the 2-3 or 3-4 squads, but could never get it done due to the above factors.

It's always and adventure bowling in a "parking lot".
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agroves

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #6 on: May 25, 2004, 12:37:42 AM »
Heck, our State tourney didn't even reoil between team events.  You bowled with what you got.  I think we bowled the second squad of the day.  The heads were okay but the mids were fried and the backends had a touch of carrydown.  I shot 643 I think.

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loose5682

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #7 on: May 25, 2004, 12:41:21 AM »
Well, the last tournament I bowled around here that had squads was the local City tournament, and I don't believe they reoiled as I heard people making a fuss about it (not quite complaining, they weren't really angry...), and i'm from the good ole' Illinois here!
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JOE FALCO

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #8 on: May 25, 2004, 09:28:24 AM »
I've been thinking on this .. trying to find a solution that would satisfy the CENTERS and the BOWLERS!

On everyone of these tournaments there are entry blanks circulated months before the actual bowling. On this leaflet they always ask you to choose the SQUAD TIMES/DATES that are available. Wouldn't it be ACCEPTABLE to all involved if they SPELLED OUT when the LANES were going to be OILED? There are some bowlers (from what I hear) that PREFER OLD OIL and some it DOESN'T MATTER while there are JERKS (like me) that would like to have FRESH OIL.

Something like THIS THOUGHT would keep the bowlers happy and perhaps GET MORE ENTRIES. Since the ABC sponsors these tournaments and since the ABC is being replaced .. wouldn't it be a GOOD SUGGESTION for the NEW MANAGEMENT. It certainly doesn't HURT THE BOWLERS! What do you think?

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cgilyeat

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #9 on: May 25, 2004, 09:58:40 AM »
Joe,  I understand yhout frustation and what you are sayimg, but as you said, we have had this discussion on here before.  Logistically and finacially, there is just no way to have a fresh shot for every squad.  I still disagree that this is a majot resaon why tournamnts are losing bowlers.  I took a look at the tournament web page, and the schedule is similar to there assocataions tournaments.  Now, it wold be nice if there entry blank would have specified the oiling times so the you would know when there is a fresh shot, but it doesn't.  Since you were at 12:30, and it was a doubles and singles squad before you, I would not expect that the the lanes would be bone dry, unless they out out a light shot to begin with.

Even at the ABC Nationals, you are not going to get fresh shot every squad.  They oil the lanes there at 7:00am, 2:30pm and 8:30 pm. Team event sqauds are at 2:30pm and 8:30pm, Doubles/Singles are at 7:00am, 9:20am, 11:40am, 5:30pm, and 11:30pm.  Obviously the 5:30 and 11:30pm Doubles/Singles squads are going to be a little on the dry side, but that's what you get.  

The point I'm trying to make, is that, with rare exception, your will never get a fresh shot for each squad in a tournament.  Adjusting to the different lane conditions is part of the game, that's why were carry multiple balls to leagues and tournaments.

JOE FALCO

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #10 on: May 25, 2004, 10:58:09 AM »
CQUIL .. Understand your comments .. I don't think my suggestion is stating OIL every session .. I think my recommendation is that we have the ENTRY BLANKS define WHEN OILING WILL BE ACCOMPLISHED!

I have come to the conclusion that BOWLERS will accept ANYTHING! I think that's foolish .. if you pay your ENTRY FEE .. you are entitled to an EQUAL SHOT! I agree that some PREFER lighter oil .. if this be the case .. my suggestion gives them the OPPORTUNITY to chooses what they like!

I would venture a guess that this approach will find the DRIER SQUADS quite EMPTY! Perhaps THEN we will have a FAIR SHOT giving to all!

I laid out the schedule as you stated for the Nationals. It appears that the SINGLES/DOUBLES at 9:20AM and 11:40AM are those not getting a FRESH SHOT .. all TEAMS and ALL OTHER S/D seem to be getting fresh. My other thought is the timing for S/D .. an hour and twenty minutes is pretty fast .. guess there are fewer bowlers on the lanes.  PERHAPS less bowling ... maybe that may excuse fewer oiling sessions!

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Debina

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #11 on: May 25, 2004, 11:42:28 AM »
It'd be nice if there was a way to get fresh oil on the lanes, for sure!

I went to Wichita for women's nationals the first week of May. Got there a day or so early, so I visited the two houses just prior to my squad times to see what I could expect. Didn't see the actual dressing of the lanes for the team event at Thunderbird, but did see the machine being packed up to be stowed away, so I assume they had just done some lane work. Actually saw the lanes being dressed before my squad time at North Rock, so I don't even have to assume there. Imagine my surprise when I showed up for team event the next evening and they hurried us onto the lanes without dressing the lanes. Then the next day, same thing happened for doubles/singles.

Seems to me that if the logistics of dressing the lanes before each squad is too much of a nightmare, that at least there should be some consistency for squad times. If you choose to bowl the second squad, you should know up front that you'll be bowling second-shift oil. However, I still think that at a national tournament scheduling should be such that everyone gets the same shot.

Deb

cgilyeat

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #12 on: May 25, 2004, 01:09:49 PM »
Joe, you're pretty much correct. The only fresh shots at the Nationals are the 7:00am Doubles/Singles, and the 2:30 and 8:30 pm Team squads.  The other Doubles/Singles follow another squad, either team or Doubles/Singles.  When you enter the Nationals, you can select your team squad, either 2:30pm or 8:30 pm, but the ABC assigns the Doubles/Singles based on your team squad time.

For example (this is what I have this year), I leave tomorrow for Reno, bowl Team at 2:30 on Thurs, and Doubles/Singles and 9:20am on Fri.  Since we will be following another Doubles/Singles squad, the shot will not be broken down as much as the guys who have the 5:30pm or 11:30pm DOuble/Singles squads.  It's still not a fresh shot like team, but given the shot there, it may actually be better, I'll know on Fri.

Edited on 5/25/2004 1:08 PM

JOE FALCO

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Re: Tournament TOAST!
« Reply #13 on: May 25, 2004, 04:26:33 PM »
Good luck on your bowling .. be interested to know how you do!

Deb .. I agree with you 100%

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Hit them light and watch them fight
      J O E - F A L C O
RIP Thongprincess/Sawbones!