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Author Topic: sport bowling  (Read 2902 times)

mumzie

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sport bowling
« on: June 28, 2004, 04:29:39 AM »
What would happen to the sport of bowling if all proprietors switched to a sport shot without telling anyone? Would anyone really notice?

My thinking is that the elite player would know the difference - at least when shooting spares.

The THS bowler would probably blame the lanes, then march into the pro shop to buy the 3 or 4 new hook monsters that came out that week. (is this really a bad thing? see other new thread)

The average recreational bowler would probably never even notice.

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Round Balls

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #1 on: June 28, 2004, 08:09:26 PM »
It not good for bussines! That why don't want sport shots. I don't care what you say but that simple truth.
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mumzie

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #2 on: June 28, 2004, 09:12:38 PM »
Round - I agree with you - but if you reread the original post, it said ALL proprietors. This would mean that Joe Bowler wouldn't have Easy Lanes or Wall City to choose from - all conditions would be equally challenging.

Would bowlers continue, or would they quit, or would they notice?

(pssst - if you've been reading the "hardwick thread" on the pba message board, the general consensus is that the easy lane conditions are killing bowling - not the equipment.)
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MSC2471

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #3 on: June 29, 2004, 12:54:31 AM »
If every center had to conform to a standardized sport shot, you would lose bowlers at first but I think you could gain more people in the long run, as long as there was something in place for people to learn more about the skills necessary to playing a sport shot. Right now in my local area you have too many people who only bowl once a week on the THS with 10 year old equipment and still averaging 220. What incentive is there to practice when you can shoot 700 every other week without really trying?

I doubt we will ever see the day that there is one uniform sport shot that all centers will use. But I believe there can be a way to possibly have a choice of 5 to 10 different shots that could be the uniform shots every house must be required to use, which would still challenge the bowlers to earn their scores rather than buying the latest hook in a box ball to shoot lights out...

Matt

Traumatize

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #4 on: June 29, 2004, 01:19:39 AM »
I think sport bowling is a really great thing.  But its purpose is for the Pros, college bowlers getting ready to go pro, and for big money tournaments.  I love the challenge, and how much it makes you become a better bowler.  I also bowl on house shots too, which the purpose of it is to have fun and relax a little while bowling.  Most people that bowl want the shot to be easy so that they can score well.  They are in leagues to be with their friends, drink, and have fun.  They do not want to worry about lane patterns or any of that.  Proprietors are in the business to make money, and satisfying their customers is the only way to do it.  They put out easy shots so that guys and girls are happy.  If these people wanted a challenge they would join a sport league, or bowl sweepers and tournaments.
     Bowling, like a lot of other sports comes down to money.  People spend money to enjoy themselves, and expect to have fun.  The happier the proprietors make the customer, the more money they make.  It is a Win, Win situation with house shots.  Sports shots are designed to bring out the best bowlers, and make sure that the better bowlers win the big money tournaments.
     I love this sport, and I think sport bowling has done a lot to help the sport in determining the better bowlers.  But the separation has to be clear from sport and house bowling.  People need to know what they are bowling on, before wasting their money not having fun.  Just my 2 cents.

laufaye

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #5 on: June 29, 2004, 02:45:18 AM »
What about to have all proprietors to put out atleast 1 sport league, just 1 please.... even with 10 teams still good, just let the serious bowler get serious, let the joe bowler have fun with the fun league, we can all be a happy bowler.
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toddler95

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2004, 03:22:12 AM »
Bowlers;

I like the idea of having a more uniformed type of pattern for the typical leagues.  A 300 would be a better feat, along with a 700.  I personally have not had either, I've only shot a 299, & a 697, but I know of certian houses that there a quite a few bowlers who average 210-230, but take those bowlers to a tournament, and they bowl worse than me & my 190 average.  If people want to bring back respect & dignity to the game I think there should be some type of a uniformed pattern or patterns.

Proprieters;

There is a drawback to set patterns, some bowlers would not want to return to that house, but in my opinoin it would be beneficial. My mens league team changed houses due to the new ownership.  They were given 1 year, but did nothing impressive to keep my team.  The previous owners made the leagues feel that they were part of a family, in fact I know that an entire league changed houses due to the owners also.  I personally think that there is more to a person, team, or league staying at a perticular house than just the shot that is put on the lanes every week.  If an owner wants to increase revenue, than make some changes!  Fix the air handlers on the roof instead of using 6 foot fans, upgrade the lanes, make the necessary repairs, try to change the clientel that frequents the lanes( gang bangers, trouble makers), make sure that the staff is friendly and competent.  I knows that these things may seem far fetched, but it takes money to make money, tap those credit lines.  These are some of the ways I know of to keep bowlers from leaving, & even attract new bowlers.

I could probably go on for a while, but for now you get the picture.  Sorry for my ramblings and mis-spellings, as this is just the way I feel.

     Thanks for reading,
            Todd
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Edited on 6/29/2004 3:23 AM

mumzie

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #7 on: June 29, 2004, 12:17:38 PM »
Good point, Bob.
Do you really think, though, that if the only shots a THS bowler could find anywhere were sport/tough shots, that they'd quit bowling?
Not the folks I know.
They might go out on the quest for the perfect equipment, but once they realized that the equipment wasn't the issue, I think they'd step up - AS LONG AS THEY COULDN'T JUST MOVE TO THE NEXT HOUSE DOWN THE ROAD and find a house shot.
Oh - certainly a few would, but I don't think most of those would be gone for long.
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kendog

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #8 on: June 29, 2004, 12:51:01 PM »
Personally, I like the idea of choice. My home house has both choices side by side. Last week at our Sport league, we heard one 300 announced and a couple of others 290 or so. We just smiled and said "let's see 'em come down here and try that!" We have like 26 teams in our Summer sport league, and the same goes for fall Sport in this house (52 lanes). I'm enjoying the challenge, but admittedly there are many who would not see the pleasure in it that some do. Of course, many houses are just not big enough to be able to do this. This house is full from 1-52 on the night that I bowl with three leagues including a sport, house shot, and no-tap; what more could you ask for?
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SrKegler

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #9 on: June 29, 2004, 09:02:05 PM »
Personally, if the lane conditions were made more difficult I would be spending more time at the lanes practicing to maintain my average.  Most serious bowlers would probably do the same thing.  That in itself would benefit the bowling alleys.

One thing to keep in mind though is no matter what type of shot the house puts out, it is going to favor one style of bowler over the other.

Right now the wall seems to favor the high rev crankers.  Us down and inners don't have as much lane to play with.

I would like to see standards tightened up gradually, maybe go from 3 units minimum to 8 unit then to 10 units.  This would still give the alley the chance to put some hold area in the middle, just take away the errant misses outside.
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9orbetter

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #10 on: June 29, 2004, 09:37:30 PM »
Very good question, for there are many good opinions...
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mumzie

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #11 on: June 29, 2004, 10:37:47 PM »
Bones - you said:
 
quote:
Mumzie, the reason bowling has been popular is due to the fact that it is one of the easiest sports in which to become decent in the shortest amount of time.

However, we often talk about how easy lane conditions are killing the sport, because it's too easy. Where do we draw the line? Which is it?
In the past (I'm talking 60s and 70s), with more challenging lane and equipment conditions, bowling was EXTREMELY popular.
Now, we say it's the most popular participant sport, yet we see the sport dying at it's highest level. Little is being successfully done to retain the beginners/recreational bowlers.

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All things are difficult
before they are easy.
---- Thomas Fuller
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SrKegler

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #12 on: June 29, 2004, 11:11:13 PM »
I've had new bowlers tell me the game wasn't exciting enough.  They can come in and throw a few strikes without knowing anything about the game.  With a little coaching, they can average around 140 fairly easily.

I had a youngster (15) tell me he shot a 225 game and then lost interest because his dad bowls and only averages 190.

I don't really think the challenge is there anymore.  Strikes used to be hard to come by, it took a lot of practice to learn to cover those important spares.

Now, spares don't really matter as much.  So what if you open, just string 4-5 to get the score up there.

I used to have the same problem with my kids and video games.  As soon as they completed the game, it lost its appeal.  Was just too easy to go thru the game the 2d time.


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MSC2471

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #13 on: June 30, 2004, 04:26:22 AM »
When I was growing up in my small home town, bowling was the entertainment within the center of town outside of a couple of pizza places. There were no clubs, there were no movie theaters, and I wasn't old enough at ages 6 through 12 to play any organized sports, so bowling became the sport I was drawn to. Outside of the fact that my mother and father each bowled in 3 leagues during the week, so I would be down at the lanes 6 nights a week. My parents couldn't afford to buy an arsenal of bowling balls for me- so I learned on white dots and yellow dots for 12 years. My average steadily climbed to mid 180's as a result. My father put a premimum on spare shooting and I was not a bowler who normally put more than a double or triple together in a game, but covered 90% of my spares.

College increased my desire to learn more as I got the chance to bowl in all kinds of houses on all kinds of different lane conditions across Massachusetts, New York, Connecticut, New Jersey, Delaware, North Carolina and Ohio to name a few of the states. Sometimes I would bowl well, other times I would stink up the place, but every experience remains in my playbook and you never know when that will come back in another league or tournament situation.

What I see today bowling with my daughter is more of an instant gratification situation. She bowls a 110 game (she's 10 and it's her first year bowling) and gets upset because someone else bowled a higher game (not factoring in the number of years that person has been bowling). She gets upset when I throw 250 games, not taking into account the fact that I've been bowling for 29 years. She figures she should be bowling better because she wants to see higher scores, without putting in the practice to learn about the game, lane conditions, her bowling style, etc.

Bowling is a lifelong commitment for us- and until another generation treats bowling as this same lifelong journey that we treat the sport as, we will see less people bowling leagues and more recreation bowling...

Matt

MichiganBowling

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Re: sport bowling
« Reply #14 on: June 30, 2004, 07:42:20 PM »
Just to let you all know what's possible...

I know of only 4 sport leagues that have existed in the state of Michigan since sport bowling came out.  1 in Jackson, MI has about 8 5-person teams;  one in Waterford has I think 10 or more trio teams, one in Bay City folded, and one in Midland folded only because they found a league to fill the house rather than only a few lanes.  So there are only currently 2 sport leagues running in Michigan that I am aware of.

During my travels around the state this summer, I have found no fewer than 7 new sport leagues starting up with very strong possibilities of success.  There is a sport buzz going around.  People are talking about it and people's minds are changing before our eyes.

Mumzie, I know your post was "what if everybody went to it", so I am just pointing out that I don't think it needs to happen that way.  Maybe I shoulda started a new post.  Oh well

I have been promoting sport bowling heavily for the past season and last summer as well, and I think it's really paying off.  I think just discussing why sport bowling is an important idea with as many people as we can in our local areas can go a long way in bringing integrity back to our game.
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