Our center runs a Strike Pot where you have to get strikes in certain designated frames.  Get all the strikes in those frames and you win the pot.  Well, there was a controversy (what else is new) so I am polling the knowledgeable members here to see which interpretation of the rules you agree with.

In one of the games the center had the form printed out looking like this for the 10th through 12th frames:



 

 
 ___________
|   | X |   |
 -----------

Now, the bowler who raised the argument with the center believed that the strike in that frame meant that you could either start with a spare and then strike in the 11th or you could double in the 10th to meet the requirements.  The center said no, the only way you can strike in the 11th is by having a strike in the 10th.  If you go 9 count, spare, then strike, that means the nine count is the 10th, the spare is the 11th and the strike would be the 12th which does not meet the requirement.  What the center is saying the bowler actually did would look like this:

 ___________
| 9 | / | X |
 -----------

  

So, the strike the bowler got in that game was actually the 12th, and not the 11th like he thought.  He did not meet the requirement and did not win.  After that argument, the center changed the forms so that the 10th and 11th had to be strikes ( I was wondering why they changed all of a sudden).

 How would you interpret that requirement?   I disagreed with the center and apparently, most of the bowlers around here who I spoke with.  I would have agreed with the bowler who complained if I had been there at the time it happened.
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I just want 2C was'zzub.
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I am the SGT Schultz of bowling.
"I know nothing!"

I would take it the same way the center stated. There are really only 10 frames but there is 3 parts to to frame 10. It is impossible to get a strike in the 11th if you don't throw the first strike in the 10th. Throwing a 9 count in 10th would result in being a spare in the 11th if you picked it up. Now if you had needed the strike in the 12th...that would still be possible as long as you at least spared in the 10th and 11th. It's really only common since. The fact that they changed the rule didn't really change anything...it just worded it to where people could understand it better. You would have to get a strike in 10 to even have a chance to get it in the 11th.

But if they were requiring you to strike on the 10th and 11th ball they should have put that in there originally as they changed it too.  If they are not requiring you to strike on the tenth ball then you simply need to knock ten down in the 11th which was what they were asking for.  It is a mistake by whoever made up the sheet but they should not make others loose for their mistakes.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

Before I could respond any further on this, I had to go to the center and dig something out of my locker.  It is one of the original entry sheets from July 2003.  For the tenth frames of the three games, it looks like this:

 

 

 -----------
|   | X |   |
 -----------
| X |   |   |
 -----------
| X | X |   |
 -----------

That is what they were using until a couple of weeks ago when they added the additional first strike in the first game's tenth frame.

Going by what they were telling me last night, each ball in the last frame counts as one frame, so if I were to throw a washout and chop the spare conversion, going 6 and then 3, that would be a 6 count in the 10th and a 3 count in the 11th, or:

 

 
 -----------
| 6 | 3 |   |
 -----------

I always was under the assumption that that was just the 10th frame, not the 10th and 11th.  So, it seems like most people are agreeing with the center's point of view?
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I just want 2C was'zzub.
____________________________________

I am the SGT Schultz of bowling.
"I know nothing!"

So, the 3 count is in the 11th?
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I just want 2C was'zzub.
____________________________________

I am the SGT Schultz of bowling.
"I know nothing!"

Try looking at it this way.  The 10th frame allows you to throw THREE balls, the 10th, 11th and 12th (assuming you don't open).  You need to have a strike on the 11th ball to win the pot.  In order for that to happen the 10th ball would have to be a strike.

The house did not change the rule. They simply showed the double in the 10th frame to avoid any further misunderstanding.
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LadyW....

Edited on 10/6/2004 8:55 PM

This is my opinion.  You only get a 12th frame if you strike in the first 2 shots in the 10th.  That means the 10th frame is either a strike, spare, or open.  If you fill the 10th frame (strike or spare), the next ball you throw is the 11th frame.  So if you throw strike, strike, (fill ball/12th frame), or spare, strike, the bolded strikes are the 11th frame.

The one center locally that does the "break the bank" pot (as we call it) doesn't ever use anything in the last frame.  I don't know if it is to avoid controversy or not, but we've never had a problem.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

Generally the instructions will say they require some “x” number of strikes to win the pot.

If the third game said they required 4 strikes in the last game, in third, sixth, eighth, and then the one indicated in the tenth, then the instructions are wrong with their explanation.

With them saying you have to strike in the 11th (the second ball thrown in the tenth) you have by “defacto” required a strike in the 10th, so in reality they are requiring you to throw 5 strikes in the last game (in my example).  

I would say spare then strike in the tenth fulfills the requirement.