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Author Topic: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15  (Read 10245 times)

ITZPS

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Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« on: April 16, 2015, 10:41:08 AM »

I'd say this was a perfect example of how not to play the lanes down there. After watching Vermilyea's group do as well as you can reasonably expect on those conditions, these guys did just about the opposite. Derek figured it out and got lined up for singles and bowled well, Dan threw the ball well for the most part, but Tim was frustrating to watch. It looks like they got too deep too quickly, were trying to keep the ball too close to the pocket, and were being much too firm. Once Derek softened up and looped it more, he did much better. I didn't initially think creating angle was going to be your friend down there, but it appears to be the opposite. Being soft and smooth and just floating it out there looks to be the best way to do it, being firm just caused way too much over/under, and getting too deep too quick down there looks like it causes carrydown to the right, but still stays dry inside, which makes the over/under even worse. For comparison:

Vermilyea's group:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2EE_eRgDIjI

Eoff's group:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-fm7S4FLmAg
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northface28

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #16 on: April 21, 2015, 02:12:03 PM »
Quote from: ITZPS on April 21, 2015, 02:06:54 PM
Barta's team also looked to be using MUCH weaker equipment, or at the very least much smoother.  I really liked Barta's approach.  There's plenty of backend, just fire right into it.  Of course, it's also hard to argue with how Vermilyea attacked things. 

Gotchall said he used an Ebonite GameBreaker 2, Rose used a Storm IQ TOUR NANO and IQ TOUR, Pohl and IQ TOUR and an IQ TOUR NANO, Waliczek a Columbia DELIRIUM, then a Roto Grip TOTALLY DEFIANT and a Hammer BAD INTENTIONS, and Barta a Hammer FIRST BLOOD and BLACK WIDOW LEGEND.

per 11thframe.com

None of these balls are weak, smooth, but certainly not weak. Plus, their whole team is very much end over end with their ball rolls, which helps.
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bradl

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #17 on: April 21, 2015, 03:01:03 PM »
Quote from: northface28 on April 21, 2015, 02:12:03 PM
Quote from: ITZPS on April 21, 2015, 02:06:54 PM
Barta's team also looked to be using MUCH weaker equipment, or at the very least much smoother.  I really liked Barta's approach.  There's plenty of backend, just fire right into it.  Of course, it's also hard to argue with how Vermilyea attacked things. 

Gotchall said he used an Ebonite GameBreaker 2, Rose used a Storm IQ TOUR NANO and IQ TOUR, Pohl and IQ TOUR and an IQ TOUR NANO, Waliczek a Columbia DELIRIUM, then a Roto Grip TOTALLY DEFIANT and a Hammer BAD INTENTIONS, and Barta a Hammer FIRST BLOOD and BLACK WIDOW LEGEND.

per 11thframe.com

None of these balls are weak, smooth, but certainly not weak. Plus, their whole team is very much end over end with their ball rolls, which helps.

The bold definitely squares with what a local DV8 staffer here said about the team pattern. She is so used to coming around the side of the ball that she absolutely struggled with coming out behind it.. she ended up being the high on her team at 610.

I didn't get to see Barta's last game (due to league), but I'm definitely watching again to see how his BWL worked. I could see something like that, especially with its OOB polished finish working (assuming he kept it at OOB). Didn't hurt that a GB2 helped to blend it out as well.

BL.
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milorafferty

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #18 on: April 21, 2015, 03:03:51 PM »
After reading these threads and watching the videos(and having bowled on the team pattern once), I think I will drill one of my NIB Motiv SR2's out of the "stash" and take it to El Paso with me.
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ITZPS

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #19 on: April 22, 2015, 06:56:46 AM »
Yeah, nothing was going sideways off the end of the pattern for them like it has been for most other people. 

Quote from: northface28 on April 21, 2015, 02:12:03 PM
Quote from: ITZPS on April 21, 2015, 02:06:54 PM
Barta's team also looked to be using MUCH weaker equipment, or at the very least much smoother.  I really liked Barta's approach.  There's plenty of backend, just fire right into it.  Of course, it's also hard to argue with how Vermilyea attacked things. 

Gotchall said he used an Ebonite GameBreaker 2, Rose used a Storm IQ TOUR NANO and IQ TOUR, Pohl and IQ TOUR and an IQ TOUR NANO, Waliczek a Columbia DELIRIUM, then a Roto Grip TOTALLY DEFIANT and a Hammer BAD INTENTIONS, and Barta a Hammer FIRST BLOOD and BLACK WIDOW LEGEND.

per 11thframe.com

None of these balls are weak, smooth, but certainly not weak. Plus, their whole team is very much end over end with their ball rolls, which helps.

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skizzle

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #20 on: April 25, 2015, 04:48:30 PM »
Quote from: northface28 on April 20, 2015, 06:50:19 PM
Quote from: Jorge300 on April 20, 2015, 05:56:47 PM
I am going to disagree with this. I just bowled on the 12th and 13th. I tried to play in and struggled, especially in D/S. The 10th frame of game 1 of Singles I moved to play straight up 1-2 on the right. I shot 247, 225 the next two games. And believe me, I am no super skilled shot maker. It worked really well for me, and the couple I did tug, went brooklyn. Don't discount this shot for those who haven't gone. I found it to be very very scoreable.

Quote from: northface28 on April 17, 2015, 08:53:35 PM
Not sure who was playing the gutter for actual score,  but you'll die a fast death unless you're a premium shot maker. I still believe breaking them down outside 5 is the way to go. I'd strongly advise staying right of 10 for at least a game in team, fight the urge to move in, you'll make your life difficult moving in too soon.

Id have to see you bowl, but I'm not buying this, a lot of times guys think they are going up 1-2, they really aren't. They're playing 5 or 4 out 1-2. Pete Thomas, is one of the best straight players in the country, and even he wasn't going up 1-2.

northface28 it is easy to doubt what you have not seen.  Just because there are not many bowlers these days that like to play, or can play 1-2, does not mean it is impossible.  I for one am not accurate enough to play out there, but admire those that can.  The house shots most of us bowl on these days do not require that type of precision.  Stand left, chuck it right and strike. 

You may or may not be comfortable playing that far outside, but why would you dispute the information that someone offered up? Seems very narrow minded to me.  How is information bad?  If can't score where I am at, then at least there are other areas to try where people have said they have had success. 

At this point I'm sure you doubt what I'm saying as well but, I have seen jorge300 throw quite a few games out at 1-2 and have success with it including those games this year in Hell Paso. 

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northface28

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #21 on: April 25, 2015, 08:11:26 PM »
Quote from: skizzle on April 25, 2015, 04:48:30 PM
Quote from: northface28 on April 20, 2015, 06:50:19 PM
Quote from: Jorge300 on April 20, 2015, 05:56:47 PM
I am going to disagree with this. I just bowled on the 12th and 13th. I tried to play in and struggled, especially in D/S. The 10th frame of game 1 of Singles I moved to play straight up 1-2 on the right. I shot 247, 225 the next two games. And believe me, I am no super skilled shot maker. It worked really well for me, and the couple I did tug, went brooklyn. Don't discount this shot for those who haven't gone. I found it to be very very scoreable.

Quote from: northface28 on April 17, 2015, 08:53:35 PM
Not sure who was playing the gutter for actual score,  but you'll die a fast death unless you're a premium shot maker. I still believe breaking them down outside 5 is the way to go. I'd strongly advise staying right of 10 for at least a game in team, fight the urge to move in, you'll make your life difficult moving in too soon.

Id have to see you bowl, but I'm not buying this, a lot of times guys think they are going up 1-2, they really aren't. They're playing 5 or 4 out 1-2. Pete Thomas, is one of the best straight players in the country, and even he wasn't going up 1-2.

northface28 it is easy to doubt what you have not seen.  Just because there are not many bowlers these days that like to play, or can play 1-2, does not mean it is impossible.  I for one am not accurate enough to play out there, but admire those that can.  The house shots most of us bowl on these days do not require that type of precision.  Stand left, chuck it right and strike. 

You may or may not be comfortable playing that far outside, but why would you dispute the information that someone offered up? Seems very narrow minded to me.  How is information bad?  If can't score where I am at, then at least there are other areas to try where people have said they have had success. 

At this point I'm sure you doubt what I'm saying as well but, I have seen jorge300 throw quite a few games out at 1-2 and have success with it including those games this year in Hell Paso. 



I need to see it, period, who cares what I think anyway? I know a lot guys that say they are playing up 1-2 and they really arent. Some of the best players in the country werent out there, but some guy on ballreviews was on the rim shooting 250? Yeah, ok.
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Jorge300

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Re: Derek Eoff livestream 4/15
« Reply #22 on: April 28, 2015, 03:04:56 PM »
northface,
     You are right, no one cares what you think! But I am sure you will share your mental diarrhea on here again and again.

By the way, I've never seen you, so I guess you don't exist either. I know a lot of people who think they know it all, but they really don't, like you. But just because you play one on ballreviews, doesn't make it true, based on your logic. But then again everyone already knew that.

And just for the record....most of the "better" players don't have to play out there because they bowl on teams that work together to break down the pattern to make it easier to score. I didn't have that luxury, so I had to find a place to play that worked for me. This was what I found after struggling to play inside with different lines and different balls. Not everyone can play there, and even those that can may not see the reaction that I did depending on their release and ball selection. But it is an option that shouldn't be discounted for those people who don't have 10 guys working together. You can dismiss it out of ignorance, pride, stupidity, arrogance or a combination of all of those. Only you and your therapist know for sure.
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