What is the difference in pitches?  If i remember correctly its how fast the thumb exits the ball.  What pitch are crankers, guys with lots of hand using and finding sucess with?

Also what thumb pitch have you found the most comfort with.  

My first ball is drilled at 3/8 and my second ball is at 1/4, i think the 1/4 feels better and leaves my hand much more fluid and clean.
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AIM = y2moe99

If you can learn to not grip the ball (I'm living proof and still amazed), you'll be surprised at what your ideal thumb pitch could be.  For years, I was at 5/16 reverse.  I'd hang up with anything closer to neutral.  Ron Clifton had me throw his ball since our hands are pretty similar.  After showing me how to hold it gently, I had no problem throwing his ball with 3/8 forward.  I had a ball redrilled with the same pitch.  It still felt like I had to grip the ball a bit, so I had another done with 1/2" forward.  It feels great.  Less grip pressure, less strain on my hand, and more control for different releases.  I may even try to go a bit more forward next time.  You never know how far is too far until you hit that point.
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Penn State Proud

Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive

To much reverse may cause you to drop the ball but way too much reverse does just the opposite.  At one time I had 1 1/2 reverse in my thumb due to an injury.  There is no way you can squeeze the ball with that much reverse and it keeps your thumb straight.  With that much reverse you will tend to hang in the ball rather than drop it.  I am now at 0 - 0 and come out quick and clean.  The standard old school drillings would be 1/8 reverse and 1/8 palm.  There is more to a fitting than just the thumb pitch.  The fingers and span are just as important if not more.  Staggering fingers and lateral finger pitches have an effect on revs among other things.  Shortening my span and moving the thumb to 0 - 0 has made my equipment a lot more comfortable and effective.

Smash49
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Smash49
robert@bowlersslidesock.com
Bowler's Slide Sock: What's the Difference?  Quality!, Construction! and Performance!  This sock will make you want to throw everything else away!
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Okie thanks for all the info guys, i think im gonna experament with drillings.  Get a spare ball, and experement with different thumb pitches and span to see what works.

My current ball is very comfortable, 1/4in backspacing , but i still feel a little grip pressure, and slight pain in my hand...

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AIM = y2moe99

Pinbuster,

I guess we can’t talk about this stuff unless we qualify some things.
#1 are we drilling for a “modern” release bowler or an “old school” style bowler?

A “modern” release bowler would be defined by most but not all of the guys on tour now.
Like Tommy Jones or Chris Barnes.

An old style bowler would be like most of the guys on the senior tour.
George Pappas is an example.

The “modern” release bowler doesn’t squeeze the ball and lays it within a foot of the foul line smoothly. The “old school” guys grip it, rip it and lift it more than 1 foot over the line.

There is a big difference in how you set up the thumb hole depending on which guy you are drilling for.
All new or unlearned bowlers should be treated like “old school” bowlers.

#2 has the bowler been taught by me or another coach that mostly teaches “modern” releases. This can be a new bowler or one that has been bowling 40 years. If so then you would need to set the thumb hole up for a “modern” bowler.

I don’t think anyone can measure a hand and say you need “X” pitch and be right most of the time for a “modern” bowler. I think you have to go through some drillings to find the best pitch.
I am mostly talking about how much “forward” pitch the thumb should have.
Most drillers just try to decide how much “reverse” pitch they should have.

Now here is the problem I am gong to run into. Most of the drillers that read this will say…”FORWARD PITCH” in the thumb? That guy is crazy!!.

There is no way I can defend myself unless I am there with you and have you throw some balls for me. But I have bowlers all over the country that had anywhere from 1/8 reverse to ¾ reverse in their thumb holes that are now throwing ¼ forward or more.

Maybe some of the bowlers I have worked with will post some on the subject.
Read the Strider post above. He has gone from 5/16 reverse to ½ forward in one week.
Strider throws the ball pretty well too, he is no hack. He is also very knowledgeable about the game in general.


So the statement…. “"In general the less a thumb is pitched under your palm the quicker the release will be." Is true! If Strider threw his old pitch now he would throw the ball backwards…I guess that is EARLY! LOL

Believe me I am not knocking you…that is not what I am about. Ask anyone that knows me.
But I have heard all my life that “reverse” is what you need if you want a quick releasing thumb and high revs. Well in MOST cases it is just not true. If you are a “trained modern release” bowler and throw a ball with reverse you will more likely release the ball LATE because you have to grip the ball. If you have to grip it then you have to tell yourself to let go. Most people will do that late in the swing and it is very hard to repeat.

Now for my next problem:
98% of the people that read this will say…”I don’t grip or squeeze the ball” and 98% of those people will be wrong. They don’t “think” they grip it but I prove to them they do. Again this is something I can’t prove or defend unless I am standing there with them bowler when they bowl.

I wish I had more time but I got to get. I also hope all this makes since because I wrote it fast and no time to proof read.

HAPPY NEW YEAR TO ALL!!!!!!!
Ron Clifton
 

Pinbuster
You are totally right!
I cover most of the US doing Clinics and seminars and most spans are too long.

I also think you are right about the semantics.
You are talking about the literal meaning of reversing the pitch and I am talking about what I see happens when the bowler throws the ball.

Example”
1/4 reverse and I see the ball leave the hand late. (cause he be squeezing)
1/4  forward and the ball leaves the thumb beside the sliding ankle. (cause he not be squeezing)

But you are right if the bowler could maintain the same grip pressure the 1/4 reverse ball will leave the thumb first and in most cases way too early.

The last ball I drilled for myself is 9/16 forward. I don’t let a bowler throw it until I have worked with them a little first or else they may hit themselves in the forehead with it. LOL

But with a little work they can then throw it and lay it on the foul line smooth as silk with more revs than before.

You are a good man I hope we get to meet up one day. I will buy ya beer…or soda your pick.
I need to do a clinic in Kansas….you got 6 bowlers in Kansas? LOL
Have a great year!
Ron Clifton

Ron,

Do you believe that the modern release as you teach it requires a more closed hand (shorter span and more forward thumb) than the "old school" release?