BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: JPbowling151 on February 12, 2014, 12:48:45 PM
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I've been having some trouble with my thumb hanging up in the ball. It only seems to happen towards/during the 3 game of league, I'll start to hang up where the webbing meets the top of the thumb causing me to place my thumb only to the 2nd line not quite all the way in so I can still release the ball. Overall sizing of my thumb is fine, I'm just hanging at the top. Should I just pull the trigger and give the top a little more bevel or just use easy slide to combat the hang? Also, is it possible for a urethane thumb slug or thumb mold to naturally get tacky over time even after cleaning it out?
Hope I make some sense and Thanks in advance!!
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I would have your ball driller check your pitches in your thumb as this might be why you are hanging up.
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I find slugs get slicker over time due to the natural oils in your skin. If you're hanging at the top, but don't want to bevel it with a sander, why not try a bevel knife to clear out what little piece of insert you're hanging on without creating a more rounded top with a sander.
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Sounds like your span may be too long. Your thumb socket should be directly over the top of the hole. You shouldn't need much bevel at all, and if you think you do, you most likely have a span problem and possibly a pitch problem.
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Sounds like your span may be too long. Your thumb socket should be directly over the top of the hole. You shouldn't need much bevel at all, and if you think you do, you most likely have a span problem and possibly a pitch problem.
It's possible, I recently changed thumb pitches in order to get a better grip & have a more relaxed feel of the ball. I originally had 1/8 right 1/8 reverse being left-handed and eventually went to 0 reverse 1/8 left which is where I'm at now...didn't adjust the finger pitches or span when I did this though. I plan on heading to the shop later to work things out.
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If your hanging in the thumb hole and the hole is the proper size, it' probably because the there is not enough reverse pitch. Generously beveling the hole will help, but in the future you should try more reverse pitch. Also make sure you keep your thumb dry.
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I'd say a span adjustment and a bit of reverse pitch in your fingers is probably in order, I'll bet that will solve the problem. I really wouldn't suggest adding reverse to the thumb though, that will just make you grip harder and compound the problem, especially if it's a span problem. If a ball fits well you shouldn't need much if any reverse and little bevel (generally, not always, every hand is different). Excessive beveling is usually required for spans that are too long. Again, if your span is too long, adding reverse to the thumb will just compound the problem rather than fix it. Span is probably the most important measurement to get right in a fit.
Sounds like your span may be too long. Your thumb socket should be directly over the top of the hole. You shouldn't need much bevel at all, and if you think you do, you most likely have a span problem and possibly a pitch problem.
It's possible, I recently changed thumb pitches in order to get a better grip & have a more relaxed feel of the ball. I originally had 1/8 right 1/8 reverse being left-handed and eventually went to 0 reverse 1/8 left which is where I'm at now...didn't adjust the finger pitches or span when I did this though. I plan on heading to the shop later to work things out.
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At the risk of offending some folks: you can remove a small amount from rear of thumb hole if the idea of front bevel is not attractive. You have to have room for knuckle to clear the back of the thumbhole. never did like much bevel myself, just made room in the back for thumb knuckle to clear easy. leave the sides of your thumbhole alone.
If you don't have a thumbhole slug, the material in todays balls get just a bit tacky to thumb.
Last but not least, make your you're not letting you wrist break back a bit too soon if you're tiring as the night goes on
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Yeah, having a slug is a good idea. Sometimes the tacky shell of a bowling ball can grab you on the way out. May not be a span or pitch problem at all.
Regarding the bevel issue, if your ball fits right and your thumb exits the ball straight upon release, you shouldn't need any bevel anywhere to accommodate the knuckle clearing. A proper fit will allow your thumb to come just as straight out of the ball as if you just put your thumb straight in and pull it straight back out. If you can put your thumb straight in and pull it straight back out with no problems, it should come out of the ball just like that when you release it.
At the risk of offending some folks: you can remove a small amount from rear of thumb hole if the idea of front bevel is not attractive. You have to have room for knuckle to clear the back of the thumbhole. never did like much bevel myself, just made room in the back for thumb knuckle to clear easy. leave the sides of your thumbhole alone.
If you don't have a thumbhole slug, the material in todays balls get just a bit tacky to thumb.
Last but not least, make your you're not letting you wrist break back a bit too soon if you're tiring as the night goes on
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It's possible, I recently changed thumb pitches in order to get a better grip & have a more relaxed feel of the ball. I originally had 1/8 right 1/8 reverse being left-handed and eventually went to 0 reverse 1/8 left which is where I'm at now...didn't adjust the finger pitches or span when I did this though. I plan on heading to the shop later to work things out.
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Ok so you went from a faster release angle to a very slowed one and now you're hanging...logic here dictates you made too much change. I would go back to 1/8 right and zero reverse...you made 3/8" angle change and nothing else...
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Justrico, didn't we have some disagreements in the past? Used to really like the "arguments" we had back when.
I always argued you had to fit the bowler and their release more than just what was "supposed to be".
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I don't believe I've ever argued that...I do not cookie cutter fit...never have never will
My analysis is based upon angles and what they create...if the only variable that he made or changed was the thumb then logic dictates it's went from a faster angle to a slower one
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Anytime you change pitches from your proper anatomical pitches one will often need to adjust bevel.
One adds bevel to the thumbhole using the Mo Pinel bevel tips contained in our reference sections.
Bottom line bevel is different under the flat of the thumb and the corner of the thumb.
As stated by Just Rico you have added 3 factors of greater holding power or said as he did 3 notches of slower thumb release.
The result is you have now lessened the separation of time between the release of your thumb and fingers. The greater that separation the typically the greater hook. Alla the no thumber(maximum time the ball spends on just the fingers!).
Great for creating area on league conditions! Bon appetite.
Regards,
Luckylefty
PS what prompted the pitch changes?
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Boy, I love it when LL starts his "baffle with BS" routine. He's so wound up in "leaves" instead of "trees" he can't see what he's stepping in.
Arguing all of these "fractions" and "degrees" sounds really good (Mo Pinelish) but they are of no use fitting the ordinary bowler and even some of the Pros. All of you who think that the Pros have to have an "exact" fit are thinking up the wrong tree.
Anybody making their living bowling can probably "throw" anything reasonable. Their objective in a grip is that it don't injure their hand.
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Boy, I love it when LL starts his "baffle with BS" routine. He's so wound up in "leaves" instead of "trees" he can't see what he's stepping in.
Arguing all of these "fractions" and "degrees" sounds really good (Mo Pinelish) but they are of no use fitting the ordinary bowler and even some of the Pros. All of you who think that the Pros have to have an "exact" fit are thinking up the wrong tree.
Anybody making their living bowling can probably "throw" anything reasonable. Their objective in a grip is that it don't injure their hand.
what?????? LOL!
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JP,
you went from 1/8" right and rev, to 0 and 1/8" left. Some hang can be expected as you may be subconsciously grabbing a bit with the new pitches or just be 3rd game swelling. Try the easy slide first and see how that goes. If it continues, light scraping and a bevel knife work can fix that. Nothing to be afraid of doing.
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It's possible, I recently changed thumb pitches in order to get a better grip & have a more relaxed feel of the ball. I originally had 1/8 right 1/8 reverse being left-handed and eventually went to 0 reverse 1/8 left which is where I'm at now...didn't adjust the finger pitches or span when I did this though. I plan on heading to the shop later to work things out.
Ok so you went from a faster release angle to a very slowed one and now you're hanging...logic here dictates you made too much change. I would go back to 1/8 right and zero reverse...you made 3/8" angle change and nothing else...
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Yes I found having the 1/8 reverse 1/8 right to be too fast to where I had to squeeze or use a lot of rosin to have a good grip. So I tried 0 reverse, 0 lateral and it was better though I still felt like I was losing it so I went to an 1/8 left and it feels like it's right but I'm hanging. I'm thinking of trying an 1/8 forward, 1/8 right.
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The angles dictates what's happening...if you're losing it on the downswing it tends to be forward/reverse...if it's interfering with the rotation it's lateral but if you look at how your thumb wants to lay, it's more than likely reverse/forward...angle under the palm slows the rotation and decreases the potential of the thumb releasing at a position for the forearm to stay 'behind' the ball correctly...
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Also, try 1/8" increments at a time so it's easier to gauge...
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The angles dictates what's happening...if you're losing it on the downswing it tends to be forward/reverse...if it's interfering with the rotation it's lateral but if you look at how your thumb wants to lay, it's more than likely reverse/forward...angle under the palm slows the rotation and decreases the potential of the thumb releasing at a position for the forearm to stay 'behind' the ball correctly...
I was losing the ball primarily on the downswing, never had problems with the rotation so I will try 1/8th increments forward and go back to 1/8 right and hopefully I'll find the right fit. Thanks!
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It's funny.
Most of my ideas on thumb pitches except the Mo Pinel bevel tip (from Mo himself)came from previous postings by Bullred.
I am a big fan of his lots of reverse and lots of palm under for a no thumb type of reverse feel with the thumb in.
I absorbed the "angles" to talk like JustRico who is on the politically correct side of ball reviews. I do get what he is saying and saying it...."sounds cool".
Regards,
Luckylefty
PS I just was fortunate to have one of the greats in our game show me his latest couple of balls and he noted that it was one piece of tape short. The pieces of tape were the thinnest slivers I have ever seen. He seems to think fit is important....hmmmm....
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Can somebody please translate any of that^^^^^
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Can somebody please translate any of that^^^^^
Flim flam, boppty bop. Thats what I read.
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Go back to 0/0 and make one adjustment at a time. That way you will. W able to tell what adjustment is causing your problem and work from there.
I bevel my thumb hole despite having gone to a relaxed fit. It just feels better to me and causes no problems with my release.
I tend to think that since you are not hanging until the third game that the problem is in your changing your release as you get tired, likely grabbing because your thumb has shrunk, and possibly coming around the ball causing it to lock on to your thumb. I would help to see what is happening.
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There's a good point in there . . most of the time when you correct your fit so you don't have to grip, your thumb will shrink, and if you don't keep up with that, you'll find yourself gripping again due to hole size rather than hole angle.
Go back to 0/0 and make one adjustment at a time. That way you will. W able to tell what adjustment is causing your problem and work from there.
I bevel my thumb hole despite having gone to a relaxed fit. It just feels better to me and causes no problems with my release.
I tend to think that since you are not hanging until the third game that the problem is in your changing your release as you get tired, likely grabbing because your thumb has shrunk, and possibly coming around the ball causing it to lock on to your thumb. I would help to see what is happening.
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Bevel should be used in regards to the shape of the thumb not to help facilitate the speed of the release
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I'm about to change my thumb pitches thanks to some help from a very helpful dude, and can't wait to change my thumb bevel to as minimum as possible. Enough clearance to get out without having to grab. That's it!
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Yes
Bevel should be used in regards to the shape of the thumb not to help facilitate the speed of the release
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Also, no one has mentioned this, but do you intake a particular food or beverage while bowling? Salt and beer are known to make your body swell over the course of the night.
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Lol also yes
Also, no one has mentioned this, but do you intake a particular food or beverage while bowling? Salt and beer are known to make your body swell over the course of the night.
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Once I had that problem with diet Dr. Pepper it actually made my thumb swell a little no joke.
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Also, no one has mentioned this, but do you intake a particular food or beverage while bowling? Salt and beer are known to make your body swell over the course of the night.
Nothing particular, when I bowl I don't eat to not get any oil on my hands and if I'm thirsty I usually drink a bottle of water, iced tea or gatorade...occasionally Dr. Pepper depending if the vending machine is out of the aforementioned beverages.
On a lighter note, I think I'll be changing to an IT thumb to make these thumb changes easier from now on, my pro is starting to get tired of drilling me new slugs so often! lol
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The debate about when to bevel is interesting. However, I don't think it is helpful. When all is said and done, some people need bevel, some do not, and there is no magical formula for determining who does.
The first question should be whether the lack of bevel is causing him to hang, and second, whether beveling the whole will solve the problem.
I do not claim to be an expert on bevel theory. However, I am confident that if the lack of beviling or your drill specs were causing the problem, you would hang from the first pitch. Again, if seeing you release the ball while not hanging, and seeing you release it during the third game when you are hanging, would help to determine what is causing your problem. Without seeing, my best guess, based on what I have seen, is that the problem is either you are grabbing the ball, or the ball is hanking on your thumb, likely do to your thumb shrinking or swelling by the third game, or that your mechanics are changing by the third game with you coming around the ball too fast, causing it to hang on your thumb before your thumb clears.
Try concentrating on staying up the back of the ball during the third game and see if that fixes your problem. Also, if your thumb whole seems lose, add tape until it is nice and snug like it should be.
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I started drinking ice tea unsweeten unless it's cold and my thumb is shrunken then I drink small coffee.