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Author Topic: Tournament play as source of income  (Read 5031 times)

Jcasteel87

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Tournament play as source of income
« on: September 09, 2013, 06:45:00 AM »
Made a decision recently to take bowling more serious and try and use it as an income stream. I've been a solid bowler (230+ average for a few years) and won several tournaments, so I figured I would have a shot at decent success. Soon found out the talent pool outside of my area is better than expected and frustration has set in. What is some advice to get through the frustration and is it possible to try and go "all in" too soon? Please only constructive criticism. Not trying to say I'm better than everyone or just whine because I'm not winning everything. Just looking for any advice on the experience from anyone else who has lived it.
Jimmy Casteel
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RCR Pro Shop
Evansville, IN

 

itsallaboutme

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #1 on: September 09, 2013, 07:06:38 AM »
The reality of bowling is that very few people even make it a hobby that pays for itself.  So it being a source of income is probably going to be much tougher than you expect.  At the end of the year when you sit down and figure everything there is probably a good chance you could make more money bowling the things you can win in your area than traveling and competing against better competition. 

There is definitely a learning curve in the transition from good league bowler to good tournament bowler.  What type of tournaments have you been bowling?  Have you at least been competitive?  When do you struggle where does the frustration come from?

If you're frustrated because you are not winning, winning is something you need to learn how to do.  You are no longer the big fish in the small pond.

SrKegler

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #2 on: September 09, 2013, 07:42:03 AM »
I done it for about 20 years.  While I won't consider myself in the same category as Bob Hanson, Avabob, or some of the other accomplished bowlers on this site, I felt I could win every tournament I entered.

First, I bowled 3 leagues a week.  One on wooden lanes, one on synthetic, and one on laneshield.  The one handicap that is hard to overcome when bowling out of town is knowledge of lane charecteristics.  You probably have the same advantage in your home house.  How to play that one pair of lanes with poor carry.  I took notes on each pair of what worked and didn't work when I was out of town just in case I ever came to that tournament again.

It's almost impossible to make a living tournament bowling.  Don't put yourself in the position of having to win.  Too much pressure.  I used each tournament as a chance to make new friends, have some fun.  Just treat the tournaments as a vacation.  Learn from each outing.
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michelle

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #3 on: September 09, 2013, 11:42:17 AM »
It was different in the days where there were good tournaments in multiple centers in an area on the same weekend and you could find 12-game midnite marathons on a regular basis.  Nowadays, just about everything is a three-game sprint for not a lot of money unless you cleaned up in brackets...and those to me are not tournaments worth looking at for a steady income stream.

One of many reasons I pretty much walked away after we lost the Tour in 2003...and generally haven't looked back. 

Jcasteel87

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #4 on: September 09, 2013, 12:19:29 PM »
I've been competitive in every event. It isn't like I'm getting last place. Just missing the cut by 5 pins or what not. Coming close enough to feel like I had the shot and just not taking the advantage. I know it isn't practical for a full income. I am an accountant for my full time job. I just like the supplementation that bowling could provide.
Jimmy Casteel
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RCR Pro Shop
Evansville, IN

storm making it rain

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #5 on: September 09, 2013, 12:41:04 PM »
In order to profit (a significant amount) from bowling, you basically need to be in the top 5% of your area bowlers. 

In my area there is a long running scratch tourney that pays in the neighborhood of 2K for first.  If you make the cut you basically get double your money.  So 2K on top is good but it drops down pretty good where 4th may pay $400.  So let's say you leave your house at 7am to bowl and if you make the match play round you may not get home until 8-9pm depending on how far you go and if you leave right after your done. 

My question would be with travel and other expenses is a profit of $200-$400 worth it for roughly a 12 hour day?  In my book it doesn't really make sense.  Granted by the end of the year it could be worht an extra 10K minus expenses of course.  I think that's why I pick and choose tournaments i enter in to.

(preface all of that by saying extra money can be either made or lost in side action)

itsallaboutme

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #6 on: September 09, 2013, 01:17:28 PM »
Your frustration may come from the fact that good tournament bowlers average 230 in league, but not all 230 average league bowlers are good tournament bowlers. 

The only way to get better is to participate.  You will pay for this education.  Just take full advantage of every opportunity and try to improve every time you shoe up.

Learn as much as you can about lanes and lane conditions.  You will figure out what patterns and lane surfaces work better for your game.

Learn as much as you can about balls and layouts and how and when to use what.  Know your equipment like the back of your hand.  No guessing if you need to change balls and how it will react when you do change.


budda

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2013, 06:51:58 AM »
You can look at it as "alternative" income.
Its hard to go out there every weekend and turn a profit. You cant be on your game every tournament you go to. For me, breaking even is always better than losing money.
I pride myself on going out there and making the cuts. Out of the 30 or 40 or 50 people that show up to a scratch tournament. If they are cutting to the top 8 or something like that, my goal is to be in the top 8.
Every tournament I go to there is always the same 4 or 5 guys that show up that you can almost guarantee will make the cut. I want to be one of those guys.
When my wife lost her job last year, I put way to much pressure on myself to go out and make money, and you just cant do that. You still have to make it fun.
There are always going to be tournaments where you miss the cut by less than 10 pins. Take it as a learning experience and move on to the next one. Every tournament is different, every pattern is different. Just keep going after it and the cashes and winnings will happen more and more.
The suggestion I will make is this, buy an app that you can use to track your bowling. They are amazing at helping you keep track of your bowling. What you are leaving, and what you are missing. Track what patterns you bowl good on and which ones you need more practice on. In and 8 game total pins tournament, leaving a 6 or 7 count could mean alot going into the last game.
Good luck in your future tournaments.
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spmcgivern

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2013, 08:08:19 AM »
The suggestion I will make is this, buy an app that you can use to track your bowling. They are amazing at helping you keep track of your bowling. What you are leaving, and what you are missing. Track what patterns you bowl good on and which ones you need more practice on. In and 8 game total pins tournament, leaving a 6 or 7 count could mean alot going into the last game.
Good luck in your future tournaments.

I think this is where you will see a big improvement.  As an engineer, and you as an accountant, I kinda enjoy the analysis of things.  Analyzing your performance will show you where you can improve and will also give you information about the locations you bowl. 

Then again, the best way to make money in my area is to be the Secretary of as many leagues as possible.  GUARANTEED payday.

itsallaboutme

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2013, 08:29:06 AM »
Well Jimmy, google is my friend and you can't hide from google.

First off, after watching your videos your physical game isn't the problem.  Some fine tuning to smooth a few things out, if we want to be picky. I watched the video from the NBT final and you throw it better than the guys that made the show.  But the best bowlers aren't always the guys that throw it the best.  The best bowlers are the guys that "get it".  Some guys "get it", some guys throw it great.  The guys that do both kick everyone's ass.

Are the results from the NBT on 7/21 pretty typical of how your performance have been?  Looking just at the results there it looks like you either don't play the lanes well as they transition or you are just plain pressing too much as you get into contention.  Which would it be?

strikeshow

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2013, 08:49:11 AM »
Many of the best bowlers on tour have day jobs and other businesses to support their bowling habit. There are even more people I have seen come and go live as either professional bowlers on the PBA or the local bowling alley hustler, and the outcomes I hear about are more often sad stories than happy and successful ones.

In essence, if you asked me what I thought, what I've been saying is, you're probably a good bowler, but I think you should still keep your day job. The numbers just don't add up with today's scratch bowling scene, anyway.

My personal bias is to use bowling as a form of recreation - like gaming, skill games, or gambling would be... because that's what "legitimate" tournament bowling is all about. You pay a fee, play a skill game, and hopefully you have what it takes that day to beat everybody else in the field.

You mention you average 230 in league - the new "bar" for professionals and league bowling is literally a 255 average these days. Those guys at the highest levels are just on a whole other spectrum. Add the variable that the top 5% of bowlers from your area and other areas will be competing at the same level as you now, and we all know that most "good" bowlers will transition the lanes much differently than it would at league. The advanced level of lane play and the way the field breaks down patterns are things most don't/cannot practice for.

Either way if you're going to "chase the tour," keep bowling as much and for as long as you can financially, emotionally, and physically support yourself. I can guarantee that something "challenging" will happen when you are chasing the show. The way you answer those challenges in life and sport will determine how successful you can be.

In the end whatever you do, keep it fun. Remember, recreational bowling doesn't mean it can't be competitive, too.
STRIKESHOW

avabob

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2013, 12:45:22 PM »
I have had pretty good success over the years, although I never was a PBA member or bowled a lot of high roller tourneys until I retired.  I have only had three seasons in 40 years that I was much more than $1000 ahead at the end of the year counting travel and equipment.  There is not enough money anywhere in bowling to more than cover your travel costs.  It has always been that way.  I remember talking to a good friend of mine who was a very good regional PBA player in the 80's.  One year he bowled all the regionals with a win and was a top 5 player who got to bowl in Atlanta for the regional players championship.  He said he barely broke even after travel, and dropped his card shortly after that season.   

Truth is that as someone else mentioned in this thread, you should look at bowling as something that will make you enough to keep it a very low cost hobby if you are very good.  Enjoy the game and the competition, but don't expect to supplement your income to any great degree year in and year out.  By the way, I was an accountant too. Could have made a lot more money doing a few tax returns every April than I ever made bowling.   

This thread reminds me of an old joke.  A PBA tour player was asked what he would do if he won the lottery for 1 million.  He thought a minute, then said he would stay on tour until it was gone.   
« Last Edit: September 10, 2013, 12:51:30 PM by avabob »

JOE FALCO

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2013, 01:36:44 PM »
AVABOB .. that is funny!
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swingset

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2013, 06:57:55 PM »
The truth is you're not going to make any income tourney bowling, not unless you're consistently untouchable on everything you roll on.

You might make enough to pay for the hobby, travel, expenses, maybe even enough to pay for Christmas now and then, but that's about it unless you're a winning pro.

Hate to be a wet blanket, but you'll find it out regardless. No reason you can't enjoy yourself, but make your goals realistic.
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Jcasteel87

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Re: Tournament play as source of income
« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2013, 07:01:38 PM »
Well Jimmy, google is my friend and you can't hide from google.

First off, after watching your videos your physical game isn't the problem.  Some fine tuning to smooth a few things out, if we want to be picky. I watched the video from the NBT final and you throw it better than the guys that made the show.  But the best bowlers aren't always the guys that throw it the best.  The best bowlers are the guys that "get it".  Some guys "get it", some guys throw it great.  The guys that do both kick everyone's ass.

Are the results from the NBT on 7/21 pretty typical of how your performance have been?  Looking just at the results there it looks like you either don't play the lanes well as they transition or you are just plain pressing too much as you get into contention.  Which would it be?

Yes that is usually how my performances pan out. I am in it for the majority of the even then it just seems to fizzle out. I know that I am not going to be the best all the time or even the majority of the time honestly, I just would like to make a little money here and there. Thanks for the compliments on the physical game. It is actually frustrating because people compliment me, but I don't win enough in my opinion. After reading all these responses, I think I will need to adjust my plan going forward. I'll just work more in the pro shop or something, It still has to do with bowling :P.

Thanks everyone for your advice/opinions.
Jimmy Casteel
900 Global Regional Staff
RCR Pro Shop
Evansville, IN