BallReviews
General Category => Miscellaneous => Topic started by: Dogtown on April 23, 2013, 01:15:48 PM
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So, I was in Tulsa this weekend bowling the Oil Capital Open. To my disbelief, 925 was leading singles. I was coming in on 221, so my chances of winning were 0.000%. Handicap was 75% of 220.
Apparently someone shot 823 off a 174 average. They also shot 690 scratch in doubles, which they were also leading. Don't remember seeing his name in all-events. I would be curious to know.
Second place was 810 or something like that. There was over 100 pins difference between 1st and 2nd.
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I was there this weekend too. I saw that and inadvertently said something out loud. A guy walked by and asked me if I knew the guy. I said no. He said he knew the guy and that he's a sandbagger. He could easily avg. 210-220 if he wanted too. I also heard he was injured last year and that is his left-handed avg but, of course, I assume he shot right handed.
It's all speculation though. Going off of what I heard.
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And nobody is attempting to get this guy disqualified? Probably won't happen anyway . .
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I thought sandbagging was allowed only in California :D
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What Is guys name or where is he from. I have an idea of who it is
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I know several teams from Wichita that stopped going to the Oil Cap because scoring got so high.
The same thing has happened to the Southwest tournament. A lot of locals still bowl it since it is currently being held in town but scoring has been very high the last few years.
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I bowled Southwest tourney for first time this year and I really got to say, it was pretty cake up there. If 925 is leading the Oil Capital tourney, thank God Im not wasting my money and going this weekend.
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See 900 ain't $hhhhhhhhit. Is 925 a record for handicap series I wonder?
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See 900 ain't $hhhhhhhhit. Is 925 a record for handicap series I wonder?
Really? That's like asking if the Holocaust was the best example of genocide...
Maybe there was some sarcasm lost in the midst of translation, but why would anyone celebrate sandbagging when it's one of the reasons many leave the sport of bowling?
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i hear ya . but believe or not ive seen worse
we had a guy come in and get 155 pins handicap
and for 3 games including his handicap he shot 1010
and again im asking myself what good is it that i carry 225+ ???
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See 900 ain't $hhhhhhhhit. Is 925 a record for handicap series I wonder?
Really? That's like asking if the Holocaust was the best example of genocide...
Maybe there was some sarcasm lost in the midst of translation, but why would anyone celebrate sandbagging when it's one of the reasons many leave the sport of bowling?
Yes I'd say you missed it all together.
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See my posts on what's wrong with bowling today . .
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Why doesn't USBC keep up with tournament averages? If a tournament is USBC sanctioned, it would be easy for them to turn in the scores. It would be no different then any sanctioned league.
That would help end some of the sandbagging.
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Seanchristopher, do you remember the guys name leading the tournament? I was curious to look him up. The Oil Capital does not post updates on the tournament.
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I wish somebody knew his name
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I would bet the Oil Capital is not updating the standing for a reason. If they post 925 there would be a lot of people canceling out. On the Southwest I was told the house set the shot an it is what there league's play on. What I have seen in the last few years tournament scores have skyrocket.
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Seanchristopher, do you remember the guys name leading the tournament? I was curious to look him up. The Oil Capital does not post updates on the tournament.
I do not. I really should have wrote it down and looked him up on bowl.com.
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If I said a name do you think you might remember?
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Maybe. I was thinking something Green.
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You nailed it! That's who I was thinking of Brian green from Arkansas he has done this for years. I just bowled a team squad in Pittsburg ks Sunday and he was in it. Our team knew who he was and ask them what he tried to come in at and they said 176. And they told him he bowls at 210 average or don't bowl he still bowled and got in scratch brackets. Look on bowl.con he bowls 18 games averaging 205+ the stops
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Bryan Green 183-1057 for those interested.
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The tournament in Pittsburg actually several years ago DQ him for failing to turn all of his tournament scores in for a 12 month period. He is most likely on a life time 210 ave (Scratch) for that tournament. Heck he did not even turn in his local assoc tournament scores. I am the local Assoc Mgr that the Pittsburg tournament is certified through. When they called me that Sunday afternoon by 7PM that night I found enough scores on the internet to warrant a re rate of him. They ask for all of his scores and he failed to turn in most of the ones I found. He turn in a lot of scores but most of them where bad ones. Plus I bet that 200+ aver is a travel league. But the same year they let him finish in the Top 5 singles in the Greater Ozark Open in Springfield MO. They would not even look at the scores we had for him.
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Crazy handicap scores have happened for 20 years, but seems to be worse than ever. Potential is just higher now with many tournaments raising their handicap base and percentage. Scratch scores also keep rising as things get easier. I was talking to a scratch bowler who said he's just going to tournaments for brackets anymore as he doesn't believe he has a chance to win the tournament.
Tournament directors have a lot going on just trying to keep things moving along and don't seem to take enough time protecting the integrity by identifying sandbaggers and forcing them to bowl scratch.
What are some of the successful tournaments in your areas doing right?
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And then you have the USBC saying that anything less than 100% is unfair :D
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Some of the tuornaments i've been going to are doing the smart thing and changed the prize fund to 50/50 payouts. Being a scratch bowler this works for me, on the handicap side there's almost no way to prevent sandbagging.
There's also some leagues that bowl on "non certified" challenge patterns, so basically they have way lower averages, but the re-rating doesn't apply (although we know the saverages aren't really reflective of ability especially when tournaments are held on house shots) If I were a handicap player this type of thing would infuriate me, as some of these guys are killing it on the handicap side of the payouts.
Crazy handicap scores have happened for 20 years, but seems to be worse than ever. Potential is just higher now with many tournaments raising their handicap base and percentage. Scratch scores also keep rising as things get easier. I was talking to a scratch bowler who said he's just going to tournaments for brackets anymore as he doesn't believe he has a chance to win the tournament.
Tournament directors have a lot going on just trying to keep things moving along and don't seem to take enough time protecting the integrity by identifying sandbaggers and forcing them to bowl scratch.
What are some of the successful tournaments in your areas doing right?
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You nailed it! That's who I was thinking of Brian green from Arkansas he has done this for years. I just bowled a team squad in Pittsburg ks Sunday and he was in it. Our team knew who he was and ask them what he tried to come in at and they said 176. And they told him he bowls at 210 average or don't bowl he still bowled and got in scratch brackets. Look on bowl.con he bowls 18 games averaging 205+ the stops
The first name someone mentions and you nail it. That's really sad that he has that reputation in another state. Hope he feels good about cheating a deserving bowler out of a couple grand.
At least I know I went in with a 6 handicap and a clear conscience and am in the top 10 in singles, doubles and all events with 3 weekends remaining. I wish that I and the team event would have shot a little better.
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See my posts on what's wrong with bowling today . .
We'll probably continue to disagree on the root cause of bowling's overall problems, but we probably agree that this tournament is a disaster.
Handicap + Lack of Average Enforcement + House Shot = Jokeathon
I don't get why anyone with a decent average and any confidence in their ability to compete at the scratch level would even think of entering this event. It's clearly a cesspool of handicap sandbagging.
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Anytime you enter a handicap tournament you run the risk of having this happen to you.
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This is why I only bowl in the local tourney, Nationals, and a tourney we travel to just to gamble and play the ponies. Can't compete with the sandbaggers and I refuse to play their game.
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Sad thing is he tried it again the next weekend an hour añd a half away. At least he got caught the second time.