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Author Topic: Urethane ball for short sport pattern  (Read 11525 times)

LyalC52

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Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« on: October 30, 2015, 11:20:22 AM »
I'm looking to get a urethane ball for an upcoming pattern change in my sport pattern league.

Is there really much difference between a Motiv Rebel Tank, Storm Pitch Black and a Hammer Black?

Which would you choose and why?


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milorafferty

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2015, 11:38:47 AM »
I would and did choose the Rebel Tank. But only because I match up very well with the halogen core and have had some success with my Artic Sniper(Same cover) on dry conditions.

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amyers2002

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #2 on: October 30, 2015, 11:53:28 AM »
I haven't seen the Hammer black yet but the pitch black is earlier and stronger than the rebel tank by quite a bit. I don't match up well with the lower amounts of surface on the pitch black or most likely the Black Hammer. If you are old enough to remember I would say the pitch black is closer to the scuffed urethanes while the Rebel Tank reminds me a lot of the old Blue Pearl Hammer Urethane
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xrayjay

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #3 on: October 30, 2015, 12:05:12 PM »
So the new black hammer is as strong as the pitch black? that's really not a true urethane ball then?

I'm currently using the blue hammer with the vibe core for my second shift league, and having fun with it. I know some didn't like it, but for me, it's first out of the bag.
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amyers2002

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #4 on: October 30, 2015, 12:24:25 PM »
Quote from: xrayjay on October 30, 2015, 12:05:12 PM
So the new black hammer is as strong as the pitch black? that's really not a true urethane ball then?

I'm currently using the blue hammer with the vibe core for my second shift league, and having fun with it. I know some didn't like it, but for me, it's first out of the bag.

I have not used the Black Hammer or seen it thrown as I stated. My grouping it with the Pitch Black is that both balls come with a very low grit surface which doesn't usually work out well for me and my slower ball speed. Sorry If I confused anyone.
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avabob

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #5 on: October 30, 2015, 01:59:46 PM »
I am not familiar with many of the urethanes, although I currently  use a Blue Hammer, and have had the Natural prior to that.  The thing to be careful of on short sport patterns is the amount of head oil.  No matter what you do with the surface on a urethane, carrydown can become a big issue.  I would go with any urethane that has a core you like, and not try to get too aggressive with the surface.  Also depending on the length of the pattern, you may find a low flare solid reactive such as the IQ tour or Arson Low flare as effective as a urethane. 
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spmcgivern

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #6 on: October 30, 2015, 03:22:01 PM »
Not to be Debbie Downer, but why do you feel you have to use urethane?  Depending on the number of games you will bowl in a shift, I wonder if you need it.  Pros don't use urethane on short except once the original shot has broken down significantly.  (at least not that I have noticed) 

You will want to start with stronger balls with a surface around 1000.  As the shot breaks down you will want to ball down.  That is when you can eventually end up with urethane, but it shouldn't be the first ball out of your bag.

The only reason I can think bowlers want to start with urethane is because they are not able to play the short patterns properly and refuse to get away from the track area.  You have to get outside.
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LyalC52

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #7 on: October 30, 2015, 03:31:20 PM »
yes, I'm looking to add a urethane for when the lanes do break down, not as a bench mark or first out of the bag
I'd be more than happy to leave it in the bag all night, but want the option if needed

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Impending Doom

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #8 on: October 30, 2015, 11:32:57 PM »
Urethane is great when you're butting up against the friction. I just threw my Booyah and on a very wet dry house shot, it allowed me to square up in the dirt and play where the dumpers wreck from. So there's that.
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Dave81644

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #9 on: October 31, 2015, 12:38:12 PM »
I just posted about this in the Hammer section
The new black hammer is like the "old school" urethanes IMO
i had the recent blue hammer and it hook-stopped at 20-25'
this new BH doesn't do that, its super predictable downlane
perfect for the short patterns and burned out heads
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xrayjay

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #10 on: November 01, 2015, 07:57:48 PM »
Quote from: Dave81644 on October 31, 2015, 12:38:12 PM
I just posted about this in the Hammer section
The new black hammer is like the "old school" urethanes IMO
i had the recent blue hammer and it hook-stopped at 20-25'
this new BH doesn't do that, its super predictable downlane
perfect for the short patterns and burned out heads

Thanks for your post. I use the blue hammer for my second shift and was thinking to add another urethane, the BH to the bag.
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avabob

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #11 on: November 02, 2015, 10:17:26 AM »
Here is the problem with depending on aggressive surface on urethanes to get a ball reaction.  We went through this 30 years ago and the problem is worse today.  Urethane surfaces that have a surface prep of 1000 or less polish to the lane so quickly, while at the same time carrying oil off the head. This causes them to quickly lose their reaction. 

What people forget is that during the urethane era we not only were bowling on short patterns, but on heavily walled short patterns with little oil ouside of 7 or maybe 10 board.   Today on a short sport pattern you have volume all the way to 2 board.  Sometimes urethane can work on these patterns, if the volume in the heads is not too high or the pattern is really short ( under 30 feet ).  I have had good luck with urethane, but only when I keep the surface tame, and don't look for any out angle.   
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spmcgivern

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #12 on: November 02, 2015, 10:45:04 AM »
Quote from: avabob on November 02, 2015, 10:17:26 AM
Here is the problem with depending on aggressive surface on urethanes to get a ball reaction.  We went through this 30 years ago and the problem is worse today.  Urethane surfaces that have a surface prep of 1000 or less polish to the lane so quickly, while at the same time carrying oil off the head. This causes them to quickly lose their reaction. 

What people forget is that during the urethane era we not only were bowling on short patterns, but on heavily walled short patterns with little oil ouside of 7 or maybe 10 board.   Today on a short sport pattern you have volume all the way to 2 board.  Sometimes urethane can work on these patterns, if the volume in the heads is not too high or the pattern is really short ( under 30 feet ).  I have had good luck with urethane, but only when I keep the surface tame, and don't look for any out angle.   
+1

Too many people think urethane is the answer only because they don't know a better way to attack the pattern.  Short with bounce outside is different than Cheetah or similar.

Maybe late in a shift you can use urethane but for most (99%) of us, it isn't the best option.
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Dave81644

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #13 on: November 02, 2015, 04:08:09 PM »
Agree with above statements
i usually look for the strongest piece the lane will allow on the shorter patterns
whatever piece will allow me to control the backends
the Urethane worked after league on the same pair and only if up 1 or 2 board where the friction was
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avabob

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Re: Urethane ball for short sport pattern
« Reply #14 on: November 02, 2015, 05:29:11 PM »
Urethane works for people who understand the benefit of playing direct, and have a release that allows them to do that. In todays environment there are many times where we can out hook our rev rate, creating entry angle without strong continuation.  This leads to poor carry.   Urethane works best when we can stay way out and feed the ball up the boards without any out angle.  If your release, or the lanes still force out angle the ability to be successful with urethane decreases dramatically.  Better to go with a real tame solid resin ball that is not impacted as much by carrydown.     

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