Author Topic: usbc sportshot crap (Read 20884 times)

tfav44 · « **on:** April 20, 2008, 05:12:34 AM »

is anyone else sick of the sportshot crap the usbc keeps shoving at us, I have read that league bowling membership is declining, iknow that this is true in my area. I live in mich. and the decline of the auto industry is having a huge impact on our leagues.Jobs, Money, and time are tight so guys are having to cut back. the usbc is basically ignoring normal house leagues and is pushing pba experience and sport leagues. the thing is we don't have the time and disposable income to devote to having all this extra equipment and practice time. everyone on my team averages over 200, we have all decided to cut back to once a week bowling. we tired of the usbc telling us that what we are doing doesn't measure up and for the "integrity of the game we should switch to a pba exp. league.
thats my rant
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tfav44
twisted fury
eraser boost
hot rod super sport pearl
a bad night of bowling is better than a good night at work.
every frame is a opportunity to succeed!
www.virginiabeachtraveltips.com

Atochabsh · « **Reply #76 on:** April 22, 2008, 01:22:12 AM »

quote:
For someone with your background, I find it funny that you would attempt to make the claim that the THS bowlers run the sport. You may run the Recreation, but you most certainly do not run the SPORT.

Sorry but they do run the sport. They run the sport because of sheer numbers. That's the sheer numbers that sanction in THS leagues vs Sport/PBA leagues. If all the THS leagues were to give up sanctioning, the sport of bowling would quickly die. Like an atom bomb.

Now you have the proprietors also running the sport. And they are concerned with volumne and the $$s brought in. It doesn't matter to them if its THS leagues, Cosmic Bowling, Birthday Parties or Sport Leagues. I think you can imagine where Sport and PBA leagues are on this list of priorities.

This era of bowling could very well be the end of league bowling as the country knows it. Within 5 years, there could be no National body and only local governing bodies with small groups of bowlers in "clubs".

Erin

EagleHunter · « **Reply #77 on:** April 22, 2008, 02:25:18 AM »

Perhaps you need to re-read that post...the leaders of USBC and BPAA are now talking about "GROWING THE SPORT," not growing the recreation. The recreation side has been there forever and for a long time proprietors felt they could get away with using it alone for profit while neglecting the sport side altogether (including competitive league bowling).

I will also reiterate, since most of you are under the impression that you "run the sport"...if that were true, then YOU are completely responsible for the ridiculous shape our sport is in. Sure there are economic factors, and the like, but YOU masses have apparently been in control of all decision making that relates to the sport. So if you want to take credit for everything, I guess you get the bad as well. After all, it was Joe Bowler at the Conventions who couldn't agree to the "Mustare rule" so the Board had to take action on your behalf. Sure is a good thing there are some people out there looking out for the Sport!

302efi · « **Reply #78 on:** April 22, 2008, 08:49:33 AM »

I think its pretty clear now !

Most of these people screaming "change the game" and want sportshot to replace THS, just can't compete in THS leagues !

You have 3 different levels of adult bowling:

1: THS house leagues
2: Sportshots/PBA exp leagues
3: PBA

When someone says they avg 220-230 on a THS, does that piss you "real bowlers" off ?...Good I hope so.

If the THS has inflated avgs or not, don't cry and complain when you can't score as high as the 10 board area cranker. Get some revs and work on your game so you CAN compete in that situation.

Like I said before, if everyones putting up telephone numbers on a THS, why can't YOU ?...If your so good that you can out avg me on a sprotshot, why can't you beat me on an easy THS !?

As I said, "good bowlers" should not even try to compete on a THS, why they don't carry and the 10 borad area cranker does, don't cry.
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quote:
I will head to my local pro shop. Right after I buy it online.

When faced with a difficult situation, Jesus asks himself, "What would Chuck Norris do?"

Robo-Arm bowlers SUCK...

badnuzjr · « **Reply #79 on:** April 22, 2008, 08:57:19 AM »

THS needs to be reserved for House run bowling leagues. Like the Nascar league or the Shrek have-a-ball league. Anything run by the USBC needs to move towards sport compliant where they control the shot and create a more even playing field. Right now who knows what each house's typical shot is and how they compare. They are all different and then the USBC throws all these scores into one big jumble where they are suppose to be able to be compared to each other yet they aren't all bowling on the same shot.
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Bad Nuz is Good News

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #80 on:** April 22, 2008, 08:59:30 AM »

quote:
Most of these people screaming "change the game" and want sportshot to replace THS, just can't compete in THS leagues !

Most, perhaps. But not all. I can compete on a THS, can win quite a few jackpots, and usually end up with one of the highest averages in any league I bowl in, despite being one of the lower rev guys. And yet I prefer to bowl a tougher shot because I enjoy a challenge and want to be rewarded for rolling the ball well and punished for rolling it poorly. However, not everybody feels that way, which is why I have no problem with leagues have just a typical house shot. People like shooting big scores and like seeing the big hook, and if people like it, they'll continue to bowl. And it's all about keeping bowlers in leagues! I do wish, however, some restrictions were put on house shots and lane inspections were done more regularly. You can have an easier, more bowler-friendly scoring environment without putting out an obscenely huge wall shot.

302efi · « **Reply #81 on:** April 22, 2008, 09:06:42 AM »

Dan Belcher, I actually do agree.

Whenever I head into another center, the outside of 5 is completely dry, so its not even really a challange....it's fun. Bowling should be fun, not a mind burning qustion of which ball to throw or what suface or what line....

Its a GAME after all!

Having said that, I think that the THS gives you a lane that anyone could score on:

~Fluffers can roll it down 5
~Tweener can play their regular 20 to 7-8
~Crankers can swing the lane

Whats really worng with a condition where everyone enjoys and can score ?
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quote:
I will head to my local pro shop. Right after I buy it online.

When faced with a difficult situation, Jesus asks himself, "What would Chuck Norris do?"

Robo-Arm bowlers SUCK...

Edited on 4/22/2008 9:14 AM

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #82 on:** April 22, 2008, 09:11:57 AM »

quote:
Having said that, I think that the THS gives you a lane that anyone could score on:

~Fluffers can roll it down 5
~Tweener can play their regular 20 to 7-8
~Crankers can swing the lane

Whats really worng with a condition where everyone njoys and can score?

I guess the problem is then that not every THS is made the same. Some are flooded inside 10, light oil 10 to 5, and bone dry outside 5. Others are medium oil inside 10, bone dry outside 10. Etc., etc., etc. I'd like to see a little less of the bone dry conditions outside as the standard. Yes, leave some friction out there for the fluffers to get something resembling roll, and it'll give the crankers somewhere to bounce the ball back from, but don't have it so wet/dry that you give the tweeners a stupidly over/under reaction like I've seen so often on many house shots around here. A little less friction right might hurt the crankers 5 or even 10 pins a game, but I'm not talking about a huge change. Just enough to even things out a little and put a little more emphasis on repetition and shot making.

Atochabsh · « **Reply #83 on:** April 22, 2008, 09:44:50 AM »

quote:
, but YOU masses have apparently been in control of all decision making that relates to the sport. So if you want to take credit for everything,

No we have not been in control of all the decision making. When you go to the annual meeting, proposals are voted on etc.....and then USBC tends to just turn around and do whatever they want anyway.

I'm not sure bowling (in our area anyway) is in a poor state. Our centers are full. Most of them from morning till night. Open play is not available week nights until after 9pm and catch as you can on the weekends.

We have community plans for two new centers. One scheduled to open this summer.

What's declining is league bowling and bowler sanctioning. That's what is hurting USBC. Creating a Sport/PBA condition is only one way to try to perk up interest and hopefully some extra bucks in Sport Sanctioning. That extra $15 you pay for sport sanctioning goes 100% to USBC, even though the center or local association provides the tape taking and reading. I'm not really sure what USBC does for Sport/PBA bowling with that extra money. But Sport/PBA bowling can't be the only way to increase participation in overall sanctioned events.

Erin

zerorev · « **Reply #84 on:** April 22, 2008, 10:09:14 AM »

302 You are missing my point yeah its fun to strike alot and shoot high scores thats why you should join a fun league. When you join a club that takes bowling and its "honor" scores seriously then it becomes something more than a game. And the sport of bowling is not about revs and speed. Its about accuracy and being consistant. If there is hold room to the left and bounce area to the right you can spray all night long with high end gear shoot high scores and think you are great. But like I said if you are accurate at least on the THS I bowl on by the 6 time of hitting the same two board area the shot is not the same. So having revs and speed does not help. If you are so interested in having fun and shooting high scores why don't you just bowl fun leagues that aren't sanctioned then you wouldn't hear anyone complain?

n00dlejester · « **Reply #85 on:** April 22, 2008, 10:15:05 AM »

I thought bowling was a game... And aren't games fun? Right? Maybe? Sometimes? Once a month? No? Never? Okay

Jorge300 · « **Reply #86 on:** April 22, 2008, 10:38:59 AM »

quote:
I think its pretty clear now !

Most of these people screaming "change the game" and want sportshot to replace THS, just can't compete in THS leagues !

You have 3 different levels of adult bowling:

1: THS house leagues
2: Sportshots/PBA exp leagues
3: PBA

When someone says they avg 220-230 on a THS, does that piss you "real bowlers" off ?...Good I hope so.

If the THS has inflated avgs or not, don't cry and complain when you can't score as high as the 10 board area cranker. Get some revs and work on your game so you CAN compete in that situation.

Like I said before, if everyones putting up telephone numbers on a THS, why can't YOU ?...If your so good that you can out avg me on a sprotshot, why can't you beat me on an easy THS !?

As I said, "good bowlers" should not even try to compete on a THS, why they don't carry and the 10 borad area cranker does, don't cry.
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302,
I was reading this over and over again and two questions keeps popping into my head: Are your freaking kidding me? How out of touch with reality are you?

And before you start whining about not being able to keep up, I averaged 230-233 for the last 4-5 years in all my leagues, I do bowl PBA Regionals and have cashed in over half of the ones I've bowled in with a high finish of 3rd. And I don't think, I know that the THS is just too easy.

Does it need to go away, no. THS has it's place, as others have said, for the family fun leagues, the mixed handicap leagues and things like this. But the sport of bowling needs to change. It needs the PBA experience and Sport Shot leagues. But the problem is people are used to averging 200-210 on their easy house china and refuse to realize that their skill level is only a 170-180 average. Name another sport where skills and results are so disparate. They feel you and the others on this thread that are too scared to give your inflated averages and show where your skill level really is. Is there anything wrong with averaging 17-180? NO, not in the least. And for tfav, no one said you need to spend extra time or money practicing. You can bowl your one night a week and average 170-180. The longer you bowl on a Sport shot or PBA experiecne shot your average will start to increase eventually, so be happy with that and enjoy life. The only time you will need to practice is if you think you can get back to the 200-210 THS average in a short amount of time. So there's your trade-off.

And as far as integrity of the game...show me another sport where Joe Citizen can go out and out-perform the professional athletes of that sport? Bowling is the only one. The average bowler on his THS pattern shoots his 200-210 average, and then watches Chris Barnes shoot 160 on TV and thinks "I can beat him". They don't understand the reality of what it took to just get to the TV show, and the difference in the conditions the Pro's face versus the league bowler. No one thinks because they can make a lay-up in the pick-up basketball game that they go one-on-one with Kobe or Lebron do they? No one thinks that if they make a tackle in their backyard football game that they go and sack Brett Favre or Peyton Manning do they? You saying that you don't care about the PBA and it has nothing to do with league bowling shows the closed minded world that you live in. No one is saying you have dedicate your life to this sport, if you want to just do it to have fun, be my guest, but if you do that, you shouldn't be outscoring the professionals that do this for a living.
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Jorge300

n00dlejester · « **Reply #87 on:** April 22, 2008, 10:47:10 AM »

Where's that guy who says I love puppies?

JessN16 · « **Reply #88 on:** April 22, 2008, 10:53:33 AM »

quote:
Quote
I think its pretty clear now !

And as far as integrity of the game...show me another sport where Joe Citizen can go out and out-perform the professional athletes of that sport? Bowling is the only one. The average bowler on his THS pattern shoots his 200-210 average, and then watches Chris Barnes shoot 160 on TV and thinks "I can beat him".

This gets posted from time to time and it doesn't need to be, because it is poor logic. Joe Citizen CAN'T go out and out-perform Chris Barnes. Put Joe Citizen on a PBA shot and Barnes would eat his lunch. Put them both on THS and Barnes would still eat his lunch.

As to what Joe Citizen *thinks* he can do, so what? Plenty of people in this world are deluded. There are a lot of folks who think they can sing, and then they go on American Idol and have their dreams shattered. Plenty of people think they can drive NASCAR until you take them to the Richard Petty Driving Experience and they can't follow the chase car at 130 mph without soiling their uniform.

We're supposed to legislate based on what people THINK they can do? Nyet. This goes back to what I said earlier -- if bowlers would quit worrying about what everyone thought of them, and just bowl, we'd be fine. But too many people are apparently bowling to be worshipped or revered, and that's as much a perversion of the sport as bowling on THS is.

Jess

JessN16 · « **Reply #89 on:** April 22, 2008, 11:02:39 AM »

quote:
Jess,
As for your comments about bowling elitism...you are 100% correct. I am proud to say that I am one of them.

God forbid that I expect the work and dedication I put into my game to mean something. God forbid that anyone who takes pride in putting 100% into getting better actually want that improvement to mean something. Heaven help the person who works their tail off but always seems to fall a bit short of their goal for getting upset when watching someone throw 12 shots, 12 different ways, on 12 different lines, with 3 nose shots, and 4 brooklyns, with their 170-ish average, while achieving that very goal which seems to be forever out of reach for the one who is actually working to attain it.

Over the long-haul the good bowlers win. That is the way it should be. Accomplishments should not be easy to attain. If they are easy then it is not a sport.

First of all, you missed my line that whatever shot you put down out there, I'll still bowl. Quit lumping "me and my brethren" together. I don't need cake to live and I've plainly said a couple of times that averages could be reined in about 10-15 pins or so and not lose a significant number of bowlers.

My argument is purely from the standpoint that if you want to go to sport conditions -- which will drop most averages 30-40 pins -- or limit ball tech, you'll lose a third of your sanctioned bowlers at least, and probably much more than that. When you start talking about losing those kind of numbers, now you are threatening my enjoyment of the sport as a sanctioned bowler because you'll be threatening sanctioned bowling itself. And no matter how much better a bowler than me you are, in terms of USBC membership, you and I both hold one vote and you're no more important to this sport than I am.

If you're going to advocate decisions that would endanger the membership base just so you can feel better about your awards, expect me to fight you every step of the way. What you do on the lanes and what you do off the lanes are completely separate. If you want to make me respect you, don't show me your awards -- show me 10 newcomers you've successfully recruited to leagues. Show me the beginner you agreed to let bowl on your team, or the group of four newcomers you left your old team to join so they could feel comfortable.

Jess

n00dlejester · « **Reply #90 on:** April 22, 2008, 11:33:57 AM »

If you guys want to bowl on "tougher" patterns, or think that the THS is the bane of bowling, then go candle pin bowling.

Edited on 4/22/2008 11:34 AM

Author Topic: usbc sportshot crap (Read 20884 times)

tfav44

usbc sportshot crap

Atochabsh

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EagleHunter

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302efi

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badnuzjr

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Dan Belcher

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302efi

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Dan Belcher

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Atochabsh

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zerorev

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n00dlejester

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Jorge300

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n00dlejester

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JessN16

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JessN16

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n00dlejester

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