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Author Topic: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?  (Read 7446 times)

splendorlex

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Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« on: May 30, 2007, 06:22:03 AM »
I have a few major flaws in my game to correct.  I have a poor leverage position, and I have a very poor release where I tend to come around the ball very early.  You can see my sorry action at this link.  I think the first thing I want to try and correct is my release, and learn to stay behind the ball more.  Sometimes things are working just right and I manage to get a good roll, but other times my poor release leaves me out to dry.  Is there anything you key on to stay behind the ball?  I've known about this problem for awhile now, but it just seems to be what my wrist wants to do!
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Mr. Lebowski, this is Bill Salnicker with the Southern Cal Bowling League, and I just got a, an informal report, that a member of your team, uh, Walter Sobchak, drew a firearm during league play. If this is true of course, it contravenes a number of the league's by-laws, and article 27 of the league...

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CoachLefty

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #1 on: May 30, 2007, 02:44:51 PM »
after watching your video i noticed that you tend to satnd up before releasing the ball.  you start out good then get all out of leverage and end up pulling the snot out of it.  i would try to flatten out your wrist, come up the back of the ball, and stay bent down all the way through your approach and build some fell for rolling the ball.  it may seem that it is not what your wanting to accomplish, however the best way to cure a golf slice is to learn how to hit a duckhook and go from there.  the easiest way to fix bad leverage is to create no leverage and work backward.
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BrunsWolf

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #2 on: May 30, 2007, 02:45:14 PM »
What i try to do is to try to keep my ring finger pointed at the ground at release. This won't promote a great reaction at first, but it will train your body not to come around the ball. Another thing to do is to visualize your fingers lifting through the ball as apposed to around the ball. If you keep your wrist straight, it is much harder to get your hand on the side of the ball. Your brace still allows you to turn over your wrist so it is still up to you to keep your wrist straight.

If nothing else works, go to your pro shop and have them help you tryout different pitches.

Hope this helps

On a side note, are you at Boardwalk Bowl in Orlando???
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DON DRAPER

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #3 on: May 30, 2007, 02:51:54 PM »
imagine that one hand is a gear. and also imagine that the ball is another gear. you know how two gears work with each other, don't you ?  try it.

qstick777

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #4 on: May 30, 2007, 03:03:57 PM »
quote:
Another thing to do is to visualize your fingers lifting through the ball as apposed to around the ball. If you keep your wrist straight, it is much harder to get your hand on the side of the ball. Your brace still allows you to turn over your wrist so it is still up to you to keep your wrist straight.


Thats pretty good advice.

If you find other better ways, let us know.  I've got a similar problem - started out bowling with pretty good lift, but somewhere along the line I started to turn my wrist.  Let you said, occassionally I can go back to staying behind the ball, but eventually I fall back into turning my wrist.


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Robadat

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #5 on: May 30, 2007, 03:43:05 PM »
You start to turn the ball high in your downswing.  I used to do the same thing.  I was also off balance at the line and would often step to the side after releasing the ball.

I worked through it by trying to throw it as straight as possible, staying down at the line and keeping my hand behind the ball with a free armswing, no muscling the ball.

After I was able to throw it fairly straight with good forward revs, I was able to retrain my hand turn at the bottom of the swing near my ankle.  I now have better balance at the line, a much more consistent release and have picked up a bit more ball speed to go along with my improved release.  Now, instead of pulling the ball, I more often push it outside my line when I make mistakes.

Now, I am in the process of relearning what different changes in hand and wrist positions do to the reactions I get on the lanes.  

I am bowling this summer in a different house that has slick synthetics with weak backends as opposed to my old house with wood lanes that had flying backends.  After three weeks, my average is plus 8 from my final winter league average, even though my spare conversions have dropped off quite a bit.  I find I am consistently throwing the ball outside on the left side spares (lefty) and overhooking the ball on the cross over spares.  I have to replace my plastic ball and I am going to work on using that for all my single pin spares over the summer.
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dveus

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #6 on: May 30, 2007, 04:35:25 PM »
I had/have the exact same problem. I was given a piece of advice the other week which seems to have helped. I was told to concentrate on feeling the weight of the ball on my index finger. This gave me a point to focus on instead of just saying stay behind the ball.


MegaMav

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #7 on: May 30, 2007, 04:52:45 PM »
maybe my video will help?
I dont know what to say, ive always thrown it with little a small axis rotation.

http://fear.fiyawerx.net/pure.avi

Everyone, feel free to log onto the link below to discuss.

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mrbowlingnut

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #8 on: May 30, 2007, 04:55:35 PM »
You can lead with the ring finger and you go through the ball totally, do not turn the hand at all period. The natural motion of your release will turn the ball to about a 45 degree release with most people.

If you lead with the ring and i put pressure just on my fingertips like what rolf gauger says are fish hooks, it will help relax your thumb if your span and pitches are dead on.

You will hook a ball if relax and just trust the ball with not turning your hand, it will be a forward roller but i hook a ball on average about 12 boards which is plenty. On dryer lanes it opens up and i can swing the ball enough to get by, how much hook does a bowler really need????

onlybowling

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #9 on: May 30, 2007, 05:13:55 PM »
As already suggested - working backward from the end is a great way to discover  the feeling of what really works -vs- what is really not working.  

1.  What is the position you want to be in when you deliver the ball?  How much knee bend?    How straight is your back?  Is you head up, or is your nose pointed at the floor?  Where is the balance arm? Swing leg position?
Grip your ball and just let it hang by your side.  Now move into your desired final position - find your balance - feel your body in this position - put your hand in its' final position - feel the tension in the wrist and forearm - the feeling of pressure on the fingers - is the finger pressure balanced - do you want the ball ball to feel balanced - or are you wanting to feel the weight of the ball differently?

After finding the delivery position the next step is to learn to get into that position by doing 1 step practice.  Do you remember seeing Tony Reyes do the one step delivery for the skills challenge?  

Hope this helps.

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OnlyBowling

Edited on 5/30/2007 5:12 PM

azus

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #10 on: May 30, 2007, 05:25:01 PM »
If you spread your index finger, try to have it pointing straight forward during your swing.
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AngloBowler

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #11 on: May 30, 2007, 06:25:36 PM »
I couldn't view your video as the link didn't work. However, from the advice I've seen you could try aiming for the feel of the inside of your elbow brushing your hip as you deliver the ball. It won't but if you try and press the inside of your elbow so that the feeling is of it brushing your hip, this can help.
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802dave

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #12 on: May 31, 2007, 06:53:27 AM »
As Only Bowling suggested, begin with the end in mind.  Begin with how you want to end up at the release.

Try the one step drill and finish up where you want to be - with a good knee bend and the ball close to the ankle - the farther away from the slide ankle the ball gets, the less leverage you'll get and the more your hand/wrist/elbow will come around the ball.

As this drill starts working for you in practice, add more steps until it feels right.  Good luck!

If you have recorded any of the PBA telecasts, look at the footwork and where the knees are during the pro's deliveries.  Look at the position of their knee in the slide - the position of their knee relative to their head and their center of gravity.  See how close the ball swings to their ankle at release.  Visualize what you see and go practice!

APheLion

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #13 on: May 31, 2007, 10:24:37 AM »
i also decided to stay behind the ball instead of turning my hand around the ball, what i did was to focus only on the release

when u r about to release, the fingers are pointin to the floor, and when u let it go, u should feel the ball on ur fingers and the whole motion of the ball rollin forward when u raise ur hand (to put a roll on the ball)

another way of doin it is something similar, when u r about to release, fingers point down and then u "push" the ball forward after the thumb exits, this might not be the best way but its a way to start when it comes to staying behind the ball
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splendorlex

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Re: Drills/techniques/keys to stay behind the ball?
« Reply #14 on: June 01, 2007, 09:56:44 AM »
Thanks all, I really just have to focus on changing one thing when I practice, and really try to stop my hand from turning early.
--------------------
Mr. Lebowski, this is Bill Salnicker with the Southern Cal Bowling League, and I just got a, an informal report, that a member of your team, uh, Walter Sobchak, drew a firearm during league play. If this is true of course, it contravenes a number of the league's by-laws, and article 27 of the league...

I invented America.

Proud member of the Track Legion, though I'm seeing other companies on the side.