win a ball from Bowling.com

Author Topic: Question on ball reaction/difference  (Read 944 times)

Jeffrevs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11890
Question on ball reaction/difference
« on: December 06, 2005, 02:54:29 AM »
I picked up my Mayhem last night from KOTM....see profile for specs....

Today I threw a few games at lunch with my Herc1 (again see profile) and the Mayhem....

I was on synthetics....left over THS from the night before....kind of sloppy , backends still there to a degree but fading...

Here's my question....If I threw both balls on the same lane on the exact same line...I got to the pocket great w/ both balls...the only difference was that the Mayhem had more of a pronounced move...

Just wondering why I didn't see more of a difference? The Mayhem is by far a stronger ball.....so why this ?  Is it the condition on the lane....used...carrydown, etc.....

Will I see a difference on a fresh shot ?!

Thanks.......
--------------------
JEFF
"...Sorry, I'm just,...it's starting to hit me like a, uhm....uhm...2 ton....heavy thing.."


Edited on 12/6/2005 11:45 AM

 

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: Question on ball reaction/difference
« Reply #1 on: December 06, 2005, 11:31:53 AM »
No idea where the "target hole" is on the Mayhem. Control drill plus possible flare reducing weight hole

VS

surface on Hercules is VERY rough (500 grit). Hercules is also particle.

Mass differential on both balls is the same.
Assume pin height onMayhem is 2 1/8" over midline; can tell what the Herc's pin height is.

The difference in pin placement and MB between them is almost trivial; one can often get greater differences with release variations.

So I'm almost surprised that the Mayhem is as strong as it is, compared to the Herc#1. That they can be close is not surprising. (HOWEVER, even broken down house shots MAY hide the difference in ball reactions!!!! Wait til you do much more testing before you make a decree as to which is stronger.)

Editorial:
Some of the perceived ball reaction difference can come from your own subconscious recognition of the Mayhem's advertised strength. In other words, you may be thinking on a subconscious level, "the Mayhem is a stronger ball so I'm going to rev it up more to insure I see a difference". Operative word is "may". Not to worry, we all do it whether we want to believe it or not; we're human. We can talk ourselves into and out of anything.

Realize that as much as we talk, "omigawd! did you see that ball hook"; in reality, it may be only 2 boards more than our "other" ball. Perception is everything.

Bottom line, as long as it is stronger, recognize the actual differences and take advantage of them when you can.


--------------------
"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien

"None are so blind as those who will not see."

Jeffrevs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11890
Re: Question on ball reaction/difference
« Reply #2 on: December 06, 2005, 11:46:55 AM »
Thanks charlest.....I just spoke to KOTM about it and he basically said what you said.  I'm not going to do anything about it until I see it on my league shot before scoring starts....I'll probably get a much different reaction there.

target hole is just inside the pap and is not a flare reducing, the hole is helping the midlane along w/ the pin placement.  The entire drill set up (strong control) ...gives it later revs so it has a bit more push to give it a bit more on the back (carrydown situations) but help me in the midlane, where I need it, w/ the strong pin placement and target hole. Whew...I probably screwed this up, but there ya go !

The Herc was originally 500 but it's smoothed out a bit since then w/ 20+ games on it...so it's probably more like 6-800 ....but I'm not sure....Pin height is right next to ring (1/2 inside), so a little higher than the Mayhem

Trivial difference? I'm not so sure....pin and mb combined w/ weight / target holes....these two balls have fairly different drills on them (in the strong asymetric world that is) if needed, I'll have KOTM clarify the differences.

Thanks for the insight charlest!
--------------------
JEFF
"...Sorry, I'm just,...it's starting to hit me like a, uhm....uhm...2 ton....heavy thing.."


Edited on 12/6/2005 12:37 PM

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: Question on ball reaction/difference
« Reply #3 on: December 06, 2005, 03:09:07 PM »
quote:
Thanks charlest



You're welcome. just trying.

quote:

target hole is just inside the pap and is not a flare reducing,



Holes inside PAP will reduce flare; but just a little inside the PAP is part of the Mo philosophy with a little bit of physics thrown in.

quote:

 Whew...I probably screwed this up, but there ya go !



You don't mean this drill was your idea and not kotm's?? uh-oh.

quote:

The Herc was originally 500 but it's smoothed out a bit since then w/ 20+ games on it...so it's probably more like 6-800 ....but I'm not sure....



20 games? Ok, 550 grit, maybe.  Probably not 800. They don't change that fast unless you're on really beaten up old wood lanes.

quote:

Pin height is right next to ring (1/2 inside), so a little higher than the Mayhem



Hmm, OK.

quote:

Trivial difference? I'm not so sure....pin and mb combined w/ weight / target holes....



gimme a break; you had a few unknowns in the picture. I didn't do that badly in the "test".  Maybe an 85%
 
quote:

these two balls have fairly different drills on them (in the strong asymetric world that is) if needed, I'll have KOTM clarify the differences.
--------------------


No problem. Not necessary. I don't need yet another lecture from him, only a quarter of which I understand.  :

I hope you see a little more separation between the two of them eventually.
--------------------
"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien



Edited on 12/6/2005 4:00 PM
"None are so blind as those who will not see."

Jeffrevs

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 11890
Re: Question on ball reaction/difference
« Reply #4 on: December 06, 2005, 07:34:00 PM »
Good stuff Jeff, that's great !!!

We'll see on Thursday night before scoring....I think you're right, there'll be a nice separation!

I'll report back......

P.S.  You're right.....kotm can really talk over your head can't he !?!
--------------------
JEFF
"...Sorry, I'm just,...it's starting to hit me like a, uhm....uhm...2 ton....heavy thing.."

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: Question on ball reaction/difference
« Reply #5 on: December 06, 2005, 09:58:30 PM »
quote:

P.S.  You're right.....kotm can really talk over your head can't he !?!
--------------------
JEFF
"...Sorry, I'm just,...it's starting to hit me like a, uhm....uhm...2 ton....heavy thing.."



he doesn't do it intentionally.

Look out ,,, Whoooossssh! There goes another salvo!
--------------------
"...for advice is a dangerous gift, even from the wise to the wise...."
J. R. R. Tolkien

"None are so blind as those who will not see."