Quote from: tkkshop on March 17, 2016, 04:02:45 PM

Quote from: Aloarjr810 on March 17, 2016, 03:49:52 PM

From the Daily News
http://www.thedailynewsonline.com/bdn02/bowlings-governing-body-declares-2-motiv-balls-illegal-20160317

"The president of the Motiv bowling ball company said his firm will reimburse customers in light of a United States Bowling Congress decision to declare two of Motiv’s high-performance balls illegal due to non-compliance with current specification requirements.

“While we’re really disappointed in the action taken (by the USBC), we will warranty the balls,” said Scott Wilbur, speaking by telephone from the firm’s office in Michigan. “We will not be able to reimburse drilling fees, but we will replace the bowling ball with a current model or a future release of the Jackal.”[/url]"


"“We will comply and will discontinue them,” said Wilbur, adding that the ruling will cost Motiv around $1 million."

my sources have been correct so far

Quote from: tkkshop on March 16, 2016, 08:37:53 AM

I'm hearing that this will be a 7 digit loss. And the first number, isn't a one.

Well, you're in the ballpark. 

I guess you missed the ball only replaced and no drilling comment too. Currently it is estimated for 1 million. I've been told that they are preparing for 2. All my info was from 4 pm on Tuesday.

Todvan

Some of us see the argument from our side (Motiv should pay for the drill of the new ball), others see it a different way. Its ok, not everybody will ever agree on one thing at the same time.

When I bought my Motiv GT1, it wasn't long and I got notice that they were having some separation issues with the cover and the lettering. I called them, gave them the serial number and they said mine didn't fall into the batch in question. I told them I had some minor separation and sent pictures to them. They immediately let me know that I would be receiving a new ball and that I could keep mine and use it until it got worse. It never got worse and I still use it today. But, for the life of me I never once gave the thought that they should have covered my drilling of the new ball!!

you're in the majority. Don't worry.

Steven

Just to make my position clear, and I think I explained this before, if the ball would have cracked after drilling, or any other defect had surfaced after some use, it is what it is and to get a new ball is just fine and I would eat the drilling (have done it before and will probably in the future.

All I am trying to say here is I would have never put holes in either Jackal if the ball was noted as illegal or going to be illegal because of a manufacturing issue where the ball did not pass USBC regulations, which is vastly different than a ball that has been drilled and is now cracking. That cracked ball is technically still legal for any USBC sanctioned competition provided the crack is not in your track and the ball is not falling apart. With the Jackals, no defect and the ball can no longer be used.

Quote from: WOWZERS on March 17, 2016, 07:18:23 AM

I bet the car conformed to all specs as stated and advertised. The ball did not.

Also, sorry that many others on here and the other bowling site agree with me (both posted and through PMs). This is not just me.

When you start to comprehend I would have never modified (drilled) a ball that did not conform to the specs the company selling it said it did, then you can start lecturing me about modifying anything.

Many more are disagreeing with you, 3835. All this drama over less than 50 bucks. They are GIVING YOU A NEW BALL to replace a used ball. ITZP nailed it yesterday. Get of your soap box.

Motiv is offering him a new ball and I offered him to pay for his drilling so he can save $50 bucks! Probaly that money will make your life less miserable! You are a cheap cry baby. Stop whinnying already because Motiv is not paying for your stupid drilling! GET OVER IT!!!!!!!!!

L3nn0n

Many have posted publicly and to me in a PM that they agree and have thanked me for fighting for the issue. So...if this upsets you so much, and I have no idea why because Motiv providing drilling has NOTHING to do with you....block me, don't read my posts, or whatever makes it so that your blood pressure stays under 200. I am entitled to my opinion, and my opinion is not going to change.

So to you, GET OVER IT yourself. I am allowed to state my opinion all day long. Don't like it? TOO BAD. Want everyone to agree with you? Go become the dictator of China or North Korea.

You are entitled to your opinion and you obviously do not agree with me. That's fine, that is what made the USA so great....when we had people willing to stand up on 2 sides of an issue and debate it out. I am not going to stop you from you stating your opinion with facts, not slams and for me to shut up or go away because you think whatever is the reason I am trying to get Motiv to pay a drill fee.

And by the way, as for the misfortune of others....the only misfortune here is Motiv sold a ball that was advertised as legal for any and all future USBC sanctioned competition. We know how that has turned out.

In a court of law, with civil lawsuits, isn't there a few parts to the puzzle? Can't you be provided relief in the form of actual losses AND losses for hardship/pain/suffering? Companies found guilty of negligence have traditionally had to pay more than just what someone has lost as a result of the company's negligence. The extra money is a way to tell the company, don't do it again.

Steven
In a court of law, Motiv might find out, after paying attorney fees, that they (Motiv) have to pay for new balls to be drilled for customers. If you were Motiv, would you want to risk paying attorney fees and then still find out the company is on the hook for paying for drilling? It is a risk reward type scenario.

The threat of lawsuits has been hung over Motiv. What exactly is anyone's guess...

That why y'all folks need to stay close with pro shops!!! I know if any of my balls is a warranty claim or replacement w.e, my driller will take care of it.

It's as shame that the greed of the average American person may very well put the 2nd best bowling ball company in the world out of business. Over what? $50 bucks? Balls that are illegal by an average of .0016 and .0004. Let that sink in for a minute. I'm not defending the product. I'm not defending anyone involved with this. But, .0016 and .0004....   

Cover is king. Differentials matter about as much as side weight, per USBC. And ALL of the EXPERTS here claim side weight really doesn't matter. Once again, I'm not saying that Motiv should get away with anything and that they should not be punished. But we are talking a 7 digit loss over something that TRULY does not matter in the grand scheme of things. Here is a quote from Mo, "In my experience, the layout created by the drilling technique is about 40 percent of ball reaction while the balance hole location and size are 60 percent of the reaction. I have also observed that a ball’s designed reaction may be reduced by as much as 29 percent or increased by as much as 55 percent by the drilling technique used on that ball." He also stated, "The specifications for an undrilled RipR are: diff ratio of .25, intermediate diff of .013 inches,and total diff of .042 inches.
Notice that by changing the chosen drilling technique, we can end up with drilled balls with diff ratios from .21 to .60, intermediate diffs from .008 inches to .037 inches, and total diffs from .037 inches to .061 inches."

My point? If we can manipulate these core number by the mounts listed above, how much damage did Motiv really cause by being .0016 over specification? Fine them! Put them on probation! Cease production of the balls and core in question.But do not take the balls out of the bowlers hands. They aren't gaining the advantage many of you think, if at all.

Great points, and this somewhat has been my problem with this from the beginning. People want to cripple a small business owners and their employees over this. Everyone of them is crying poor me while saying this is not right blah blah, yet have no trouble taking the hand out at any cost to the company. Motiv made a mistake it happens and they damn sure don't deserve to be sued over this. that's what wrong now everybody gets butt hurt and wants to sue for any reason at any cost.

Their is not enough money in bowling to make profit in bowling balls for everyone, some people that are in business just like making ends meat per say. You have a lot of ball companies fighting for business of a shrinking clientele. To me this is to trivial to be going on and on about.