Author Topic: All the talk about choking? (Read 4198 times)

DukeHarding · « **on:** January 27, 2008, 05:10:41 AM »

Would all the BR members, saying that Chris Barnes is a choke....

Have said the same thing about Earl Anthony, when he finished second, all those times?

Chris is right up there with all the greats...

I know a lot of people don't particularly like his TV personna.

He still is one heck of a GREAT bowler.
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Duke Harding

Greg T · « **Reply #1 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:14:01 PM »

He is a great bowler for about 7 frames. It's not the fact that he lost that makes him a choker. It's the fact that he can't make the clutch shots. 53 pins up and throw the game away ? Thats choking.

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bowlingmaniac017 · « **Reply #2 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:15:01 PM »

Didn't Walter finish second more times than Earl had wins lol?

That being said, Barnes is like 8-18 in Final Matches. If he could have pulled out 10-13 wins, he would be sitting on 21-5 or 18-8.

Barnes is touching territory in my opinion that no one else should ever touch with the talent that is out there. If he could only start winning on Sunday's, he could easily burn past Walter for wins.

He needs to know he is good, but he also needs to get a reality check and realize that although hes on a higher plateau than anyone else, he still has to show up and bowl and not take anything for granted.
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Mike

Rileybowler · « **Reply #3 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:18:54 PM »

Duke its not about finishing second its the way he does it the guy had a 53 pin lead, he had a great look to pocket , I think he just got to thinking to much maybe playing not to lose rather than to win and this sure isn't the first time. Is he a great bowler yes not a doubt about that will he be a great champion not if he keeps doing what he has been doing. A couple of tournaments he has won the big dollar ones he threw bad shots to win getting brooklyns
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Carl

oprahsdouche · « **Reply #4 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:22:15 PM »

finishing second isnt always choking. Shooting 245 and finishing 2nd doesnt mean you choke. Having a 50 pin lead going into the last 3 frames, whiffing a 10 and completely losing focus in a major, is choking! No disrespect to Barnes, but it is what it is, call it a choke, a loss, a defeat he didnt win! His glaring staredown was classic. Barnes thought he had such a great look but to be honest he was carrying some flack. Then he just hit the gas and completely blew past his break point twice. Shouldve taken the shot clock violation he rushed it.

MAJM · « **Reply #5 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:29:58 PM »

The word great gets thrown around to much today. He belongs in the PBA class of the good to very good but not the class of great.
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Juggernaut · « **Reply #6 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:32:51 PM »

quote:
Would all the BR members, saying that Chris Barnes is a choke....

Have said the same thing about Earl Anthony, when he finished second, all those times?

Chris is right up there with all the greats...

I know a lot of people don't particularly like his TV personna.

He still is one heck of a GREAT bowler.
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Duke Harding

Duke,

With all due respect, it isn't that he comes in second, but it is the way he seems to manage to do so.

If Earl Anthony was flat out winning a tournament and made some stupid, awful, or horrendous mistake that ended up costing him the championship, then YES, I would most definitely say that Earl choked. A choke is a choke, no matter who the bowler is.

Chris doesn't ALWAYS come in second, and Earl didn't ALWAYS choke away his chances at wins. There is a distinct difference between having a bad day while scoring low and just stupidly throwing your chances to win away like so much trash. I'm sure there must have been some times when Earl "choked", it is just getting to where it seems Chris does it far too often.

In this " what have you done for me lately" world, Chris is fresh on the mind while Earl is just a memory, so Chris is naturally going to catch it while Earl is going to skate it somewhat.

One thing I do NOT agree with you on is whether or not Chris is "right up there with all the greats". All time greats DO NOT have this happen to them on nearly as frequent an occasion as Chris seems to. Sometimes, yes, but almost every time in recent memory?
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Edited on 1/27/2008 2:34 PM

LuckyLefty · « **Reply #7 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:39:21 PM »

It looked to me...that Chris was in the process of "Losing his look"
in frames 7 8 and 9.

Maybe concentrating on finding the look and carelessly missed the 10!

I do it all the time but call it the 7!

In the 10th I believe he made a move slightly inside and it did not recover.

Sort of lack of concentration.....sort of a change in his shot.

Haugen "FOUND" his....right in time.

REgards,

Luckylefty
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pate08 · « **Reply #8 on:** January 27, 2008, 01:45:17 PM »

quote:
The word great gets thrown around to much today. He belongs in the PBA class of the good to very good but not the class of great.
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Your a f-ing retard. Barnes is the best bowler in the world right now. He has 2 major wins and has like 10 major tourney tv shows. He has more tv appearances than EVERYBODY since 2000. If you dont think he is great than you dont know what the f*ck you are talking about.
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DukeHarding · « **Reply #9 on:** January 27, 2008, 02:54:43 PM »

quote:
Sometimes Barnes is the Buffalo Bills of the PBA, he has it locked-up then out adjusts himself instead of just letting it flow, Shaffer did the same thing against Barnes, had it going against Weber then started pinching it at the release point with Barnes!
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Exactly.
They aren't bowling a THS.
Missing a 10 pin in the finals of a Major, is devastating.
I still think when all is said and done, Chris Barnes will be considered one of the greats of his time.
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Duke Harding

MAJM · « **Reply #10 on:** January 27, 2008, 03:18:32 PM »

quote:
Your a f-ing retard. Barnes is the best bowler in the world right now. He has 2 major wins and has like 10 major tourney tv shows. He has more tv appearances than EVERYBODY since 2000. If you dont think he is great than you dont know what the f*ck you are talking about

Let me try and lower my IQ so I can explain this to you. Barnes is great compared to a league bowler but in the PBA no. To be a great PBA bowler means you have to accomplish a few things.

You need to be able to win POTY honors. He's never done that. Also, great PBA bowlers have that "one" year where they stood out and you say wow. Barnes has never had that year. In fact in 2000 Barnes made TV Finals 12 times and went home with 0 titles. In comparison the year before, 1999, Bohn made TV Finals 11 times and went home with 5 titles. In 2001-02 Bohn made TV Finals 9 times and went home with 5 titles. I put Barnes in the same category with PA. Two very good PBA bowlers, but just not good enough to be remembered with the greats. Granted Barnes could turn it on and end up with a few POTY honors and 20 titles but until or if that ever happens he just isn't great.

There's nothing wrong with being a good PBA bowler. I think everyone who is serious about their bowling game would love to be a good PBA bowler but being great is reserved for the special.

On a side note: Barnes is a favorite of mine. Hell, I would LOVE to have his physical game, but I am objective enough to realize he is not a PBA great.
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vrbowlinfl · « **Reply #11 on:** January 27, 2008, 06:41:16 PM »

MAJM I totally agree with you. Barnes is not to me considered one of the greats. I have never seen any of the greats choke aways as many tournies as Barnes has had. Yes they have lost tournies but how many have done what Barnes has had. Being great means having a great mental game to. Barnes does not have that yet. I was watching the match today and I saw Haugen Man up and throw those strikes in a row to make Barnes throw at least one, I said it was over. I have never said that about Walter, Anthony, the Webers, Bohn, and the few others.

Yes they have lost tournies, but you know that they will come through most of the times. Plus missing a ten pin in the 9th and blowing a 50 something pin lead is something that never happened with the elite.

I watched Barnes and you could tell he was hating to get up in the tenth to throw that frame. The elite want that moment (which they would of put that match away in the 8th or 9th by picking up the spare). I love watching Barnes bowl and if he ever got that mentalality, he can be a great.

BTW remember the riches tourney which he won? He threw it so bad that it brooklyned so that win does not count
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Edited on 1/27/2008 7:43 PM

pate08 · « **Reply #12 on:** January 27, 2008, 09:23:45 PM »

After all the bad beats, chokes, and times hes gone home empty handed on sunday, he still manages to make it back time and time again.......more than anyone infact. I know if that kind of stuff happened to me, I would NEVER be able to come back the next week and make tv again, yet, Barnes does it all the time.......
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Atochabsh · « **Reply #13 on:** January 27, 2008, 11:47:14 PM »

quote:
Duke its not about finishing second its the way he does it the guy had a 53 pin lead, he had a great look to pocket , I think he just got to thinking to much maybe playing not to lose rather than to win and this sure isn't the first time.

I could see the intensity in his face that game from the very start. I think he got too intense. I think maybe he pressed too much. Its such a fine line. And with Chris Barnes, its a finer line then most.

I feel bed for him because that shot was devastating. But I also am very impressed with Haugen for being 50+ pins down in the 5th and sticking with it, finding someing and pulling it out. He deserved to win.

Erin

Fluff E Bunnie · « **Reply #14 on:** January 28, 2008, 07:46:30 AM »

quote:
It looked to me...that Chris was in the process of "Losing his look"
in frames 7 8 and 9.

I noticed that also... He just needed to make that 10 pin...

When he needed 20 in the 10th I had a feeling that he wasn't going to get it because he stopped striking leading up to it.
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Author Topic: All the talk about choking? (Read 4198 times)

DukeHarding

All the talk about choking?

Greg T

Re: All the talk about choking?

bowlingmaniac017

Re: All the talk about choking?

Rileybowler

Re: All the talk about choking?

oprahsdouche

Re: All the talk about choking?

MAJM

Re: All the talk about choking?

Juggernaut

Re: All the talk about choking?

LuckyLefty

Re: All the talk about choking?

pate08

Re: All the talk about choking?

DukeHarding

Re: All the talk about choking?

MAJM

Re: All the talk about choking?

vrbowlinfl

Re: All the talk about choking?

pate08

Re: All the talk about choking?

Atochabsh

Re: All the talk about choking?

Fluff E Bunnie

Re: All the talk about choking?