Author Topic: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper? (Read 2485 times)

Fluff E Bunnie · « **on:** November 29, 2007, 11:18:01 PM »

I am looking at these two patterns and they seem kind of similar to me yet the Viper seems to give me so many problems with transitions and figuring it out. I don't get it. Usually I can start out fine on the Viper and then it goes south quickly.

What is the big difference of this pattern? I notice it is flat on the end of the pattern and it is obviously a couple feet longer...

Edited on 11/30/2007 8:18 AM

wulfpackbwlr · « **Reply #1 on:** November 30, 2007, 10:52:04 AM »

I'll give a quick, not so technical approach of what i've read, seen, and experienced on the 2 patterns. Cheetah is 2 feet shorter with a heavier volume of oil. Cheetah also has less oil on the outside so even when the shot breaks down some, most can still find a shot no problem on the outside, whether this be moving a little in, changing to a weaker/ stronger ball, etc. Viper allows more lines. you dont see nearly as many people playing in on cheetah as you will find on viper. I would say for myself, I have been able to play both patterns similar but with different break points. on cheetah, I have been foced to get the ball 4 or further out to where on viper I can us anything between 10-4 as a breakpoint depending on where I am lining up on the lane.

now that I read this again....that's a terrible description. Hopefully someone else will chime in with a better description
--------------------
NC State Bowling Team
http://www.ncsu.edu/stud_orgs/bowling/index.htm
email: wolfpackbowling@yahoo.com
Please contact if you attend NC State and want to bowl or want to make a donation to our broke team.:-)

CPA · « **Reply #2 on:** November 30, 2007, 12:09:58 PM »

The Viper allows you to start a few boards farther inside and not so close to the gutter. This makes people more comfortable form the start.

For me the Cheetah and Viper transition differently. The Cheetah begins to hook more as the oil starts to go away. This requires either weaker covers or layouts, whichever you prefer. The Viper causes me to move farther outside during the transition, just the opposite of what you might expect.

Of course differences in lanes, wood or synthetic, lane oiling machines, lane oils, etc. also affect the transition.

wulfpackbwlr · « **Reply #3 on:** November 30, 2007, 01:28:42 PM »

CPA, that's part of what I forgot to mention. The moving the opposite directions. Viper I move right, just like you said, or change to a more aggressive ball as the night goes on.
--------------------
NC State Bowling Team
http://www.ncsu.edu/stud_orgs/bowling/index.htm
email: wolfpackbowling@yahoo.com
Please contact if you attend NC State and want to bowl or want to make a donation to our broke team.:-)

Fluff E Bunnie · « **Reply #4 on:** December 04, 2007, 07:15:25 AM »

Hmm... Working on it more. I actually tried moving right like you guys said and it worked a lot better. I went with a weaker ball out there and it made it look perfect. Also, I was able to sort of open it up a little that way to move in with the same ball.

I notice some people are able to play pretty deep on this pattern but I seem to have a better chance on the outside... I think I totally went about this pattern the wrong way before.

Edited on 12/4/2007 8:25 AM

Dan Belcher · « **Reply #5 on:** December 04, 2007, 07:27:50 AM »

Last season in my PBA Experience league, I tried a ton of different looks on the Viper... and many of them worked. On fresh, I was best off using my Special Agent, playing fairly direct from the right side of the lane with a higher ball speed, making sure I kept my breakpoint around 6 or 7. If I got inside of that, the ball wanted to roll too early and left splits. As the lanes broke down, I could either switch to my Total NV (with a highly polished surface, pin above fingers about 5.5" from my PAP, with an x-hole a couple inches above my PAP) and play fairly direct, or I could take my Spit Fire (box finish, same basic drill as Total NV but no x-hole), slow down a little and play a swing from 13 to 6. All of these lines worked at one point or another, but it all depended on how much the heads dried up and how much oil in general was out there. If the heads start going away too badly on the inside, moving outside of that dry area seems to help if you have a ball that will let you do it. Otherwise you can try to move left and slow hook it in the dry.

Jorge300 · « **Reply #6 on:** December 04, 2007, 07:44:34 AM »

A little hijack to this thread, sorry Fluff. I just bowled a regional on Cheetah, and I was very surprised at what I saw. Granted the lanes may have been the biggest part of this, we were on synthetics, though I don't know which. But what I saw, that I wasn't expecting was a very hard oil-dry line. If my break point was at 4, i'd leave a 2-10, 2-4-10, etc. If it was a 3, 2 pin or maybe a lucky swishing strike, 2 or 1 i'd hit the pocket. I was expecting a little more taper to the oik-dry line based on what I saw on the graph, specifically 1-2 dry, 3-4 slightly more oil, and then 5 in larger volumes. Not expecting to have a lot of room, but thought the 3-4 area would be more of light strike, 2 pins, not splits and washouts.

Was my thinking off, or was this a product of the house/lane surface, or maybe my equipment (I have weaker core/covers, but most are drilled med to high flare due to the fact that I throw pretty hard about 19 mph on average, with med. to med/high revs)? Any insights would be helpful. Thanks.
--------------------
Jorge300

"Hell of a situation we got here. Two on, two out, your team down a run and you've got the chance to be the hero on national television... if you don't blow it. Saw your wife last night. Great little dancer. That guy she was with? I'm sure he's a close personal friend, but tell me, what was he doing with her panties on his head?
Uh-oh, Rexie, I don't think this one's got the distance."

Fluff E Bunnie · « **Reply #7 on:** December 04, 2007, 07:52:03 AM »

quote:
Last season in my PBA Experience league, I tried a ton of different looks on the Viper... and many of them worked. On fresh, I was best off using my Special Agent, playing fairly direct from the right side of the lane with a higher ball speed, making sure I kept my breakpoint around 6 or 7. If I got inside of that, the ball wanted to roll too early and left splits. As the lanes broke down, I could either switch to my Total NV (with a highly polished surface, pin above fingers about 5.5" from my PAP, with an x-hole a couple inches above my PAP) and play fairly direct, or I could take my Spit Fire (box finish, same basic drill as Total NV but no x-hole), slow down a little and play a swing from 13 to 6. All of these lines worked at one point or another, but it all depended on how much the heads dried up and how much oil in general was out there. If the heads start going away too badly on the inside, moving outside of that dry area seems to help if you have a ball that will let you do it. Otherwise you can try to move left and slow hook it in the dry.

This one is kind of touchy because yeah you can get some spectacular splits if you pull it a couple boards and if you miss right it waves bye bye.

I can definitely see that working... I think the difference is that I am only able to increase speed to a certain point and then I might as well quit for the night because it is going to totally throw off my timing. As for slow hook it, that's pretty much my normal hook it.

I think that's what's cool about these patterns is that there are so many different ways to do certain things that it makes it a real contest to see who can figure it out first on a given night.

Fluff E Bunnie · « **Reply #8 on:** December 04, 2007, 08:09:23 AM »

quote:
A little hijack to this thread, sorry Fluff. I just bowled a regional on Cheetah, and I was very surprised at what I saw. Granted the lanes may have been the biggest part of this, we were on synthetics, though I don't know which. But what I saw, that I wasn't expecting was a very hard oil-dry line. If my break point was at 4, i'd leave a 2-10, 2-4-10, etc. If it was a 3, 2 pin or maybe a lucky swishing strike, 2 or 1 i'd hit the pocket. I was expecting a little more taper to the oik-dry line based on what I saw on the graph, specifically 1-2 dry, 3-4 slightly more oil, and then 5 in larger volumes. Not expecting to have a lot of room, but thought the 3-4 area would be more of light strike, 2 pins, not splits and washouts.

Was my thinking off, or was this a product of the house/lane surface, or maybe my equipment (I have weaker core/covers, but most are drilled med to high flare due to the fact that I throw pretty hard about 19 mph on average, with med. to med/high revs)? Any insights would be helpful. Thanks.

Hey it's not a hijack at all. I wish there were more PBA Experience posts on here.

Fluff E Bunnie · « **Reply #9 on:** December 04, 2007, 08:24:18 AM »

quote:
I just bowled a regional on Cheetah

Here's a question to those in the know:
I know they just mentioned on the show this last weekend that they changed the Cheetah to make it more difficult. Does this apply to the regionals as well?

Jorge300 · « **Reply #10 on:** December 04, 2007, 09:11:53 AM »

quote:
quote:
I just bowled a regional on Cheetah

Here's a question to those in the know:
I know they just mentioned on the show this last weekend that they changed the Cheetah to make it more difficult. Does this apply to the regionals as well?

I can't answer that one for sure, but based on the scores I saw and this one was around Thanksgiving, it certainly wasn't the case. The leader after round 1 of qualifying was averging 250. And I think it took 223/224 to make last cash spot.
--------------------
Jorge300

"Hell of a situation we got here. Two on, two out, your team down a run and you've got the chance to be the hero on national television... if you don't blow it. Saw your wife last night. Great little dancer. That guy she was with? I'm sure he's a close personal friend, but tell me, what was he doing with her panties on his head?
Uh-oh, Rexie, I don't think this one's got the distance."

Author Topic: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper? (Read 2485 times)

Fluff E Bunnie

Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

wulfpackbwlr

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

CPA

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

wulfpackbwlr

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Fluff E Bunnie

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Dan Belcher

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Jorge300

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Fluff E Bunnie

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Fluff E Bunnie

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Fluff E Bunnie

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?

Jorge300

Re: Differences of Cheetah vs. Viper?