Author Topic: My thoughts on this season (Read 12781 times)

Current Exempt · « **on:** March 31, 2008, 03:55:46 AM »

I want to thank everyone who has sent me a private message about my status and situation. I did finish out the year fairly strong and did make the cut line for next season. Now, the pros and cons. I do enjoy being one of the elite in this country. I enjoy the opportunity to make a telecast every week with a guaranteed paycheck but at what expense? If you had asked me before the season started if I could take Deanery's season and not bowl I would have said yes! He made 3 shows and finished top 20 in points and cashed every tournament. That's some season,right? Beating out 2/3's of the field on avgas. every week. Bowling 20 tournaments and being on TV every the week. Awesome bowling I think! His return? $51,000! He put in about $28,000. Boatman is another who made two shows and cashed every tournament, $39,000! He put in $28,000. This is just sad. I don't know one regional player who wouldn't kill to have 1 of those 2 seasons. So I'm still undecided about next year. Only 10 bowlers eclipsed the $100,000 mark with $25,000-$30,000 invested. Just not a good return for being the best this sport has to offer. Most of us 30-39 point guys just lost another year in any career outside of bowling for basically minimum wage. Did we the pa send the right message with Duke winning the money title when about 85% of his winnings came from two tournaments? I don't know. I do recall in the 80's when Aulby,Ballard,Voss were in the $200,000's to win the money title. Did we jump back 20 years with the way things our now? At least in the early 90's you had a chance for $25,000 incentive checks. I guess is what I'm trying to say is I don't know why every other sport can advance financially and we go back. Sorry for the ranting but these are just my feelings. I do enjoy reading all the e mails and messages sent to me as well as the reply's to my post's. Thanks again to everyone for their support.
I do not want to give out my name yet because I'm still undecided and wanted to keep this off any pba message board.

JessN16 · « **Reply #46 on:** April 01, 2008, 04:29:30 PM »

Jeff, re: Amateurs at the Open...

What you guys need are the qualifiers that golf's U.S. Open uses prior to the big show. Those are basically x-number of rounds in the weeks leading up to the Open where everyone who wants to try out can do it and they take the top few from each qualifier.

Even then, I think there's a minimum handicap needed (2.5?). But forget that, let everyone bowl in those qualifiers at five or six houses around the country.

Still charge the $500 and do it like a mini-TQR. Give the winner of each qualifier $1,000 and the top 10 percent from each a free pass into the big show. That way you've got 60 ams, tops, entered into the main Open.

My only question is whether you can get enough ams to shoe up for it, because if I had to lay a number on it I think half the ams that currently try to shoe up for the open only do it to bowl with you and the other exempts.

Jess

pop_1 · « **Reply #47 on:** April 01, 2008, 04:43:50 PM »

Amateurs

Jeff, I agree that there were some people at the Open that should not have been there. I got to watch some horrific bowling. I bowl at a higher level on a THS. But, I have not bowled the Open because I feel that I am not ready. So, I agree with you there. The only problem I see with what Rapture brought up, if its true is that that kind of talk from the bowling insiders further seperates the ordinary and the pro. I think that it could be said a different way. But, I do appreciate your honesty on your posts.

With that said, if I get my spare game in better order, I will be one of those amateurs bowling next to you.

Spider Ball Bowler · « **Reply #48 on:** April 01, 2008, 04:44:37 PM »

Jeff,

I don't see why anyone would bash you for your opinion....well on second thought, this is ballreviews.com, so undoubtedly someone will.

--------------------
Ahhh Disco Biscuits!

Spider Ball Bowler · « **Reply #49 on:** April 01, 2008, 05:10:47 PM »

I do not disagree with Jeff's statement. If you're going to shoe it up, you should follow the rules. The double jump rule is a prime example. It really is not a hard concept to follow. It just takes a minute or two to get used to doing it that way. Really if used correctly, it makes games go a lot faster, assuming everyone is ready when it is their turn.

I get annoyed while bowling in my tournament series where that rule is used and people do not follow it. I could only imagine being a pro, and bowling for my salary.

People should be explained the rule, which I know they are, then if they do not follow be given a single warning, and another explanation. If they once again break the rule, kick them out..simple enough. If they yell and scream and curse and kick and cry, warn them...do it again, kick them out. This rule would have to apply to everyone, pros included, because I am sure a lot of pros kick and scream and cry when things are not going their way as well.

If someone wants to go out and spend $500 to bowl, regardless of them being "good" enough or not, they should be allowed to do so. Afterall it is an OPEN tournament. If I was a pro or someone who could compete and do well, I would be salivating at the mouth seeing these guys coming in. Donators, I believe is the term that is used. The more money put in, the more money that comes out....well at least you would think so?

As Jeff said there are different levels of amateurs. There are the people who just want to say I crossed with Parker Bohn, and then there are the people like me, who actually believe they could be good enough to cash. Would I cash...doubtful, do I think I could, you bet ya. I am also in the group that respects what is going on. Tell me the rule, I will follow it. I won't be running up and down the lanes everytime I throw a strike, or peeing on a chair because I left a split. People that do, should be asked to leave, with no refund, pros included. All rules apply to everyone....that's fair.

I could see the annoyance of having every tournament being OPEN, but I could see the benefits as well. More prize money to me would be worth putting up with a few douche rocks....once again this is assuming I was on that level.

--------------------
Ahhh Disco Biscuits!

Jeff Carter · « **Reply #50 on:** April 01, 2008, 05:38:12 PM »

The main reason for the exempt field was very simple....to create events featuring the best of the best. When the "New PBA" began, they set the field at 128 bowlers with 64 bowlers cashing each week. The field was made up of the top 50 (

) in points from the previous year, the previous weeks cashers, regional exemptions from the previous year, career exemptions and the rest was made up from bowlers bowling the rabbit squad.

This happened for 2 whole weeks before the PBA realized that they could just open the field up ( when lanes were available ) to anybody that wanted to bowl ( members that is ). The problem was pretty evident though...a lot of bad bowling that watered down the field. The crowds were watching guys averaging 220 and 160 on the same pair, and to be honest made the PBA look like a joke. When was the last time you saw a PGA member shoot 100

At that point Steve Miller dreamed up the exempt tour concept. Do i agree with it...NO, but do i think the fields should be open to anybody that wants to bowl...NO to that either. If you open the fields to anybody that wants to bowl, then where do you draw the line. I mean i was a pretty good baseball player when i was younger but i doubt the Rangers would sign me to a contract. I was heavily involved in racing while i was growing up, but i doubt that Budweiser would stick me in Dale Jrs old ride. My point is that we need some sort of exempt field, just not sure the one we're using is the right one
--------------------
Bowl up a Storm,
Jeff Carter
www.stormbowling.com
www.jeffcarterbowling.com
www.myspace.com/jeff1295

bowlingmaniac017 · « **Reply #51 on:** April 01, 2008, 05:46:12 PM »

quote:
My point is that we need some sort of exempt field, just not sure the one we're using is the right one

You dont have to respond Jeff if you dont want, but in YOUR own thoughts what do you think should be done to better the exempt field?
--------------------
Mike

Edited on 4/1/2008 5:46 PM

tburky · « **Reply #52 on:** April 01, 2008, 05:57:13 PM »

quote:
Rapture -
Im not really sure about that....but what i can tell you is this : There are a lot of different "classifications" of amateurs. I've got my opinions on the US Open and some of those probably wouldn't be popular to most people, but its the gods honest truth.

I know i'm opening myself up to more criticsm here but i really think there should be stricter rules or a qualification process to be able to compete at the Majors. For example, i was 2 pair away from a guy that averaged 138 for the first 2 days. This guy got more 3 counts than 9 counts. Watching him, you could tell that his talent level was 170-180 MAX !!! But lets forget about his score, lets examine how he acted. Yes he had a little problem with the skipping procedure ( and for those of you that will say "the premadonna pros and their double jump" rules are all jerks...you should realize that you're bowling in a professional event and if you dont know the rules then you shouldnt enter ), but the biggest problem was the other distractions such as : slapping off brooklyn after brooklyn, stomping his foot after yet another 3 off the right, screaming into his shirt after missing his 4th single pin in a row, etc.... Yes i'm using this guy as an example, but when you watch this for 18 games it wears on you mentally. I was lucky to have 3 guys on my pair that took their turn, did their best and didnt cause any problems for those around them...but there were plenty of guys that certainly didnt do that. There needs to be a certain level of etiquette when bowling a tournament like the US Open ( and yes that also applies to the professionals ), but to many amateurs go into the event and treat it like league night. I wont go into how the amateurs tear up the pattern because on that junk, you cant really tear it up much more than it already is...so i wont blame them for the lane conditions at all. My only gripe is the constant distractions that go on around you all the time. I really hate to say it but it makes concentrating almost impossible, and when your income and job rely on your performance you cant afford that.

Now before you bash me, consider this....there are many levels of amateur and if you're honest with yourself you will know where you fit in. If you're that bowler that can compete at a high level on house patterns, with a good physical game and an understanding of how the sport should be played then i dont care if you go -400. But if you're there to get photos, autographs and to be able to go home and tell your friends that you bowled the US Open and crossed with Parker Bohn, then thats where the line should be drawn. I know everybody has a right to pay their entry fee and bowl, and i'll be the first to admit that we need the money....but think about this: whats gonna happen when you take a guy fighting for his job, exemption and livlihood and pair him up with a guy that booked 184 in league last year and is only there because he wanted to bowl the US Open. I mean if you dont think you have a chance at all, but bowl anyway...why bother ? I respect anybody and everybody for trying their best, but i love the game of golf but i'm certainly not going to drive to Augusta on Thursday and tee it up against Tiger. First of all, they flat out wont let me because im not good enough. On the PGA tour, if you record a high enough score they basically tell you goodbye and dont come back.

I guess my point is all amateurs shouldnt take offense to these comments because unfortunatley you are all lumped into one big category. But there are some people that really should invest that $500.00 in coaching instead of bowling the US Open. Now......bash away
--------------------
Bowl up a Storm,
Jeff Carter
www.stormbowling.com
www.jeffcarterbowling.com
www.myspace.com/jeff1295

very truthful

nd300 · « **Reply #53 on:** April 01, 2008, 06:12:08 PM »

Jeff and other exempt members,
I agree that there should be a line drawn.None of the "league night" shenanigans going on after you miss a spare or throw a three bagger. Yet there are some of these same amateurs who ARE capable of a good showing.
Maybe try a split level approach.....
Amateurs who average from 200-210 in one field.Take the top ten and match play them.Allow the top two or three into the Open.
Amateurs from 211 and up in the same format.
That eliminates the "donators".
Then go on with the regular format.
--------------------
Chris
JTTDB---Just Throw The Damn Ball
Don't "think"---that ball isn't in your bag yet..........

bowlitup · « **Reply #54 on:** April 01, 2008, 06:17:26 PM »

quote:
quote:
Someone front me the $8 Billion so I can get started

Do you take paypal??
--------------------
Throwing hambones since 2005.
www.myspace.com/nestes12

In this case, yes

--------------------
Ben
Quit Crying and Keep Bowling, or Quit Bowling and Keep Crying.
VIVA LA NACION!!!

Jeff Carter · « **Reply #55 on:** April 01, 2008, 06:37:28 PM »

I'm not sure how i would like to see the "exempt" field structured. It's nice having a guaranteed check, but i also see the possibility of an 80, 96 or even a 128 man field that could be filled with nothing but the best talent out there. The problem still comes down to the lack of money. If there was more sponsor money coming in, the PBA would have to rely on the Product Registration Fees less and the might free up more of the manufacturers money to pay their staff. I think everybody on Tour should be on one staff or another and be paid for their services. Once you get to elite status, you should be able to earn a living and that would certainly help.

The other problem still comes down to the prize money compared to expenses. We are the only sport that charges an entry fee that is totally out of whack compared to the prize money. When the last cash spot is only 3 1/2 times higher than the entry fee, you've got problems. This all boils down to money...unfortunately our world and society is totally driven by the almighty dollar. Without an influx on income into the PBA, you wont see any improvements anytime soon

As for the US Open....i can envision a 2 day qualifying event before the start of the tournament. You could somehow seed ( through a series of qualifications : PBA exempt player, national title holder, regional title holder, current or former Team USA, etc.... ) the top 100 players and then hold the qualifier before the tournament starts. Right now the entry cutoff is 492, so you can open the qualifier up to an additional 492 entries if you can get them. At that point you could bowl 9 games each day for 2 days, then cut the field to the top 228 and pair them with the seeded 100 players for a total field of 328 ( that would be 2 full squads in which you could strip and re-oil after each squad, eliminating the "burn" squad ). This way anybody that wants to bowl can, but only the better bowlers will actually make it into the main event. Just eliminating the lower 164 bowlers will help the overall level of the tournament. Just my opinion
--------------------
Bowl up a Storm,
Jeff Carter
www.stormbowling.com
www.jeffcarterbowling.com
www.myspace.com/jeff1295

Hogsharley · « **Reply #56 on:** April 01, 2008, 06:53:38 PM »

Jeff, what do the bowling establishments get out of hosting a tourny? Do they pay the PBA for the right to host? Do they get part of the spectator walk in fee or concessions? They are losing league lineage for a whole week so they have to be compensated in some way.

Also, what about the Pro-Am? Do all the PBA bowlers or just the exempt ones get paid? Where does all the Pro-Am money go to?
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3 holes of fun!!

Jeff Carter · « **Reply #57 on:** April 01, 2008, 07:06:22 PM »

The host center fees seem to change every year....depending on what business model they are using. I know this year it went back to the host center paid a fee ( not sure what it is ) and they kept the gate and the pro-am fees. I do know that if the host center works it, promotes it and manages the stop properly they can actually make money hosting a PBA event. Unfortunately there arent enough proprietors that are willing to make the commitment to do that

As for the pro-ams go....nobody gets paid for the pro-ams anymore. The PBA feels like its part of our job and is included in our guaranteed check. What they dont realize is that by putting the pro-ams at the end of the week, they are forcing guys to stay for an extra day or 2 accumulating expenses without adding to their income. It wouldnt be such a big deal if the PBA would work with the host center to organize the pro-ams a little better. Too many times we get booked for mulitiple pro-ams, with 10-11 amateurs on a pair. That becomes a 3+ hour pro-am and with no breaks in between. That puts us on the lanes for 6 plus hours at a time with no breaks. I personally love pro-ams, but its not fun to have to answer "how did you do this week" when you finished 48th and you're ready to go home. It may sound like im complaining, but like i said i enjoy pro-ams....i just wish they were at the beginning of the week instead of the end. I'm sure guys would be in much better moods if we had Tues or Wens pro-ams.

I also think that saturdays should be used for instructional clinics in each host city. They really should take the players that want to coach, pay them accordingly and let us educate the bowling public on PBA patterns, physical game and equipment. That way the guys that want to earn some extra money wont have a problem staying in town for an extra day or 2. Again, my .02
--------------------
Bowl up a Storm,
Jeff Carter
www.stormbowling.com
www.jeffcarterbowling.com
www.myspace.com/jeff1295

alloutsmith3 · « **Reply #58 on:** April 01, 2008, 07:41:21 PM »

quote:
Rapture -
Im not really sure about that....but what i can tell you is this : There are a lot of different "classifications" of amateurs. I've got my opinions on the US Open and some of those probably wouldn't be popular to most people, but its the gods honest truth.

I know i'm opening myself up to more criticsm here but i really think there should be stricter rules or a qualification process to be able to compete at the Majors. For example, i was 2 pair away from a guy that averaged 138 for the first 2 days. This guy got more 3 counts than 9 counts. Watching him, you could tell that his talent level was 170-180 MAX !!! But lets forget about his score, lets examine how he acted. Yes he had a little problem with the skipping procedure ( and for those of you that will say "the premadonna pros and their double jump" rules are all jerks...you should realize that you're bowling in a professional event and if you dont know the rules then you shouldnt enter ), but the biggest problem was the other distractions such as : slapping off brooklyn after brooklyn, stomping his foot after yet another 3 off the right, screaming into his shirt after missing his 4th single pin in a row, etc.... Yes i'm using this guy as an example, but when you watch this for 18 games it wears on you mentally. I was lucky to have 3 guys on my pair that took their turn, did their best and didnt cause any problems for those around them...but there were plenty of guys that certainly didnt do that. There needs to be a certain level of etiquette when bowling a tournament like the US Open ( and yes that also applies to the professionals ), but to many amateurs go into the event and treat it like league night. I wont go into how the amateurs tear up the pattern because on that junk, you cant really tear it up much more than it already is...so i wont blame them for the lane conditions at all. My only gripe is the constant distractions that go on around you all the time. I really hate to say it but it makes concentrating almost impossible, and when your income and job rely on your performance you cant afford that.

Now before you bash me, consider this....there are many levels of amateur and if you're honest with yourself you will know where you fit in. If you're that bowler that can compete at a high level on house patterns, with a good physical game and an understanding of how the sport should be played then i dont care if you go -400. But if you're there to get photos, autographs and to be able to go home and tell your friends that you bowled the US Open and crossed with Parker Bohn, then thats where the line should be drawn. I know everybody has a right to pay their entry fee and bowl, and i'll be the first to admit that we need the money....but think about this: whats gonna happen when you take a guy fighting for his job, exemption and livlihood and pair him up with a guy that booked 184 in league last year and is only there because he wanted to bowl the US Open. I mean if you dont think you have a chance at all, but bowl anyway...why bother ? I respect anybody and everybody for trying their best, but i love the game of golf but i'm certainly not going to drive to Augusta on Thursday and tee it up against Tiger. First of all, they flat out wont let me because im not good enough. On the PGA tour, if you record a high enough score they basically tell you goodbye and dont come back.

I guess my point is all amateurs shouldnt take offense to these comments because unfortunatley you are all lumped into one big category. But there are some people that really should invest that $500.00 in coaching instead of bowling the US Open. Now......bash away
--------------------
Bowl up a Storm,
Jeff Carter
www.stormbowling.com
www.jeffcarterbowling.com
www.myspace.com/jeff1295

I was at the Open all day Thurs/Fri watching and can attest that what Jeff is saying is absolutley true. There are some amatuers that should not be allowed to shoe up just for the fact that they have no clue. Its great that they love the sport and want to have the experience but there are other places for that. I'm an amatuer, not a PBA member, so I have nothing against amatuers. In fact I plan on bowling the Open next year, as an amatuer, which is part of the reason I attended this year as a spectator.

I watched you bowl a few games Jeff but never got a chance to talk to you. I plan on attending a few events for the 08-09 season so hopefully we can get a chance to chat a little bit then.
--------------------
Jason Smith
Brunswick Bowling--Proud Bearer of the Crown
VISE--The Choice of Champions

jd1319 · « **Reply #59 on:** April 01, 2008, 08:55:41 PM »

The change I would like to see, change how the exemptions work. Those who qualified for the exemption, get their weekly check, but nothing else. It wouldn't be "cashing" in the tourny. Sort of like the PBA sponsoring them.

Then, revert to the old ways combined with match play. Everybody bowling in the tourny starts the same. The exempt guys and everybody else would have to bowl the qualifiers and earn their way into the top 64 and then to match play. Many more people will have a chance to work their way onto the show, where the current system for the most part, makes it extremely difficult for a non-exempt member to have a legit shot.

DON DRAPER · « **Reply #60 on:** April 01, 2008, 09:20:38 PM »

you have to look up to jeff carter and current exempt for their patience and perseverance in regards to the ever changing role of the pba and professional bowling. here are two guys who wanted to bowl for a living yet organizational flaws are preventing just that.

entry into the major tournaments of this sport need to be more severely restricted. just because you are a bowler does not mean you can enter the us open or the pba world championship. i'm a perfect example of this. i bowl. should i be allowed to enter the us open ? based on what ? my league averages ? my finishes in local tournaments ? should i have been allowed pba regional tournaments ? ask mike austin and jeff carter about that. i cashed once in 8 tournaments. obviously i should not have the right to enter a tournament like the us open or the pba world championship or the usbc masters.

will professional bowling and the pba ever be able to regain the type of marketing and sponsorship they had in their heyday ? it's possible but not likely......the world has changed a lot since then. i wish sponsors were lined up ready to negotiate but that will take a lot of work to attract big time sponsors.

Author Topic: My thoughts on this season (Read 12781 times)

Current Exempt

My thoughts on this season

JessN16

Re: My thoughts on this season

pop_1

Re: My thoughts on this season

Spider Ball Bowler

Re: My thoughts on this season

Spider Ball Bowler

Re: My thoughts on this season

Jeff Carter

Re: My thoughts on this season

bowlingmaniac017

Re: My thoughts on this season

tburky

Re: My thoughts on this season

nd300

Re: My thoughts on this season

bowlitup

Re: My thoughts on this season

Jeff Carter

Re: My thoughts on this season

Hogsharley

Re: My thoughts on this season

Jeff Carter

Re: My thoughts on this season

alloutsmith3

Re: My thoughts on this season

jd1319

Re: My thoughts on this season

DON DRAPER

Re: My thoughts on this season