BallReviews
General Category => PBA => Topic started by: lsf_21 on February 10, 2010, 12:46:41 PM
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Robert Smith I have come to the realization that the masters and the US open are fantasy camps for some players. Today I had a guy on my pair ask if i was mandated to wear dark trousers, and he also wrote a poem about the 10 pin that he had written and felt needed to be shared. I go +9, the rest of my pair went -800. I love bowling!!!!
i laughed at this.
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GO CUBS!!!!
GO CELTICS!!!!
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I think the Masters and US Open bring out 4 types of bowlers
1) Legit contenders.
2) Bowlers that don't quite have the skills YET, but know the only way to get better is to bowl against better bowlers on harder patterns. These guys will put up respectable scores
3) Bowlers that THINK they have the skills, but don't understand why their 230 THS average doesn't put them in the running
4) The Fantasy camp bowlers who just want to say they crossed Chris Barnes at the Masters/Open
If I had the money, I'd be 4...but even if I had the money I don't think I would bother.
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It IS next year!
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Xtra Frame showed his pair for the last game of qualifying and it was pretty brutal to watch the other guys bowl. On the pair next to him, it was PDW, Malott and Tom Baker along with some little dude that couldn''t make a spare to save his life. Put Robert Smith with those guys and he probably goes +200 for the day and makes the cut.
Edited on 2/10/2010 11:08 PM
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Yeah Ive seen a ton of people at the Open that have no business being there
Unless you can consistently average over 215 on a sport pattern or PBA pattern you really have no business showing up unless you want to just donate your money
I hear a lot of guys say they do it for the experience (these are guys that average 180 on a house shot league)
if you want the experience of throwing money away send it my way I will gladly take it
I will never understand that point of view
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The USBC seriously needs to review the average requirements for the Masters. The rules state that you must average 190 or more for 21 games or average 173 in a sport league. Seems like that should be 210 or more in a house league or 190 or better in a sport league. Averaging 190 in a house league isn't much of an accomplishment, especially to enter a prestigious tournament like the Masters.
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I think they keep the min average low to get a higher number of contributors to the tournament. Also, there is an occasional bowler that comes from a dungeon center and doesn't carry the big average.
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Not too long ago, and I'm not sure if it is the same. To join the PBA they just asked either a 200 house average or 175 sport average!
That needs to be adjusted to 200 sport average and 225 house average.
My two cents.
I'd go 200 Sport Avg, 230 or even 235 THS average.
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GetOffMe10Pin
I think 220+ THS and 200+ Sport is reasonable, if you average 200+ on sport shots then the house shot average really isn't that big of a deal IMO
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BowlingChat.net (http://"http://www.bowlingchat.net")
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I would like to see the average criteria changed as well...BUT, that being said, these tournaments need these people to pad the prize funds. The sponsors aren''t going to put up every dollar for the bowlers to compete for. The prize fund has to come from the entries. If you only allow the bowlers that have "proven" themselves, these events would draw 100-125 people, max! Same with the regional tours. We need the "dead money" entrants.
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Track PBA Regional Staff
http://s318.photobucket.com/albums/mm427/thunder835/Track%20Equipment/
Evolutionary. Revolutionary.
People don''t lack strength, they lack will.
Edited on 2/12/2010 7:19 PM
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what they should do is have all the Touring Pro's and Regional guys, bowl on the same shift...
Everyone else..... on the other shift....
If you have booked a 200+ average on a sport shot league, you can bowl with the Pro's.
If not..... well your stuck with all the other donators.....
That would rid the issues of Pro's having to fight though the tough lanes when "hacks" are tearing up the lanes, and you see 4 pro's paired up and they are tearing up the lanes, because they are "working" together to score well.
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" Lift Your Skirt Grab Your Balls and Learn How to Bowl " http://coolluvr4u1976.bowlspace.com/
For my vids on youtube - search coolluvr4u1976
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220 house doesn't mean squat translating to sport. I've seen guys 220 house average 205-210 sport and guys 220 house average 165-170 sport. It all depends on the conditions the 220 is booked on. The number 220 can never be a vague estimation of ___ number to sport. There's too many factors. There's guys near 220 that throw the same ball on the same line every week for 220 in a league that shoot 720 one night and 580 the next night, then there's guys that make moves, have bad weeks, get out of a funk albeit ball matchup or tweaking something in the physical and go 220 averaging 630-720 every week with an occasional 580-600 here and one or two 780-810 sets a year. 2xx has never been an indicator of how someone can perform on a sport condition that take's them out of their physical comfort zone and makes them make shots and convert spares.
It amazes me that people still think things are this cut and dry considering the amount of variables.
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I would like to see the average criteria changed as well...BUT, that being said, these tournaments need these people to pad the prize funds.
Ya...leave it the way it is. The players and the PBA need as much money as possible.
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If you want prize money then you have to welcome the donators. Why are you scouffing at those that have the money and want the experience? They are contributing to the prize fund. Without them, prize fund gets much lower.
As a USBC member that really has no aspirations of bowling in such a tournament, I also don't like my dues going to a tournament that nearly always boils down to almost exclusively PBA members by the first cut.
Erin
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If you have booked a 200+ average on a sport shot league, you can bowl with the Pro's.
I disagree with this. They paid their same entry fee as a pro. Is the Professional's money any better? (Maybe it smells better). If you don't want them there then change the criteria.
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Put Robert Smith with those guys and he probably goes +200 for the day and makes the cut.
Robert Smith is a professional and if he can't hack it on any set of lanes then he should not bowl in the tournament.
I hate these kind of statements. It saying that he got cheated out of something.
Were those lanes longer?
Were the pins heavier?
Were the approaches shorter?
Was the oil pattern different?
Oh wait ... he was playing with a bunch of nobodies. What did they do? Screw up his line or make a mess of the oil pattern because they don't know how to break down a pattern correctly.
You all complain about the sport of bowling dying. And yet when new comers get aboard. You do what? Make fun at their inexperience, and laugh at their questions.
I guess you forgot how little you knew when you first started bowling tournaments. You won't be laughing when Tournament Entry Fees are twice the amount in 5 years and the total prize fund is less than it is now.
You will stand there and wonder what happened. Forgetting about your arrogance in the previous years.
You should welcome these new bowlers. Let them leave the tournament with a good experience. If they feel good they will come back. Some will get better, some will stay the same. Give them credit for trying.
There are plenty of other tournaments out there that keep these bowlers out.
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If you have booked a 200+ average on a sport shot league, you can bowl with the Pro's.
I disagree with this. They paid their same entry fee as a pro. Is the Professional's money any better? (Maybe it smells better). If you don't want them there then change the criteria.
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Put Robert Smith with those guys and he probably goes +200 for the day and makes the cut.
Robert Smith is a professional and if he can't hack it on any set of lanes then he should not bowl in the tournament.
I hate these kind of statements. It saying that he got cheated out of something.
Were those lanes longer?
Were the pins heavier?
Were the approaches shorter?
Was the oil pattern different?
Oh wait ... he was playing with a bunch of nobodies. What did they do? Screw up his line or make a mess of the oil pattern because they don't know how to break down a pattern correctly.
You all complain about the sport of bowling dying. And yet when new comers get aboard. You do what? Make fun at their inexperience, and laugh at their questions.
I guess you forgot how little you knew when you first started bowling tournaments. You won't be laughing when Tournament Entry Fees are twice the amount in 5 years and the total prize fund is less than it is now.
You will stand there and wonder what happened. Forgetting about your arrogance in the previous years.
You should welcome these new bowlers. Let them leave the tournament with a good experience. If they feel good they will come back. Some will get better, some will stay the same. Give them credit for trying.
There are plenty of other tournaments out there that keep these bowlers out.
Amen to that!
I'm a house hack, and I admit it. I considered bowling in the Masters this year, but decided to wait one more year. Do I have a chance? No, not even a sniff. But I love to bowl and I enjoy the experience. It's attitudes like Robert Smith that will continue to keep bowling down. So his lanes were messed up by us "common folk bowlers"? Oh yea, that must be what has kept him out of the TV show the past couple of years.
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Nine in the pit with the Tenpin left standing. dooooh!!
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If you have booked a 200+ average on a sport shot league, you can bowl with the Pro's.
I disagree with this. They paid their same entry fee as a pro. Is the Professional's money any better? (Maybe it smells better). If you don't want them there then change the criteria.
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Put Robert Smith with those guys and he probably goes +200 for the day and makes the cut.
Robert Smith is a professional and if he can't hack it on any set of lanes then he should not bowl in the tournament.
I hate these kind of statements. It saying that he got cheated out of something.
Were those lanes longer?
Were the pins heavier?
Were the approaches shorter?
Was the oil pattern different?
Oh wait ... he was playing with a bunch of nobodies. What did they do? Screw up his line or make a mess of the oil pattern because they don't know how to break down a pattern correctly.
You all complain about the sport of bowling dying. And yet when new comers get aboard. You do what? Make fun at their inexperience, and laugh at their questions.
I guess you forgot how little you knew when you first started bowling tournaments. You won't be laughing when Tournament Entry Fees are twice the amount in 5 years and the total prize fund is less than it is now.
You will stand there and wonder what happened. Forgetting about your arrogance in the previous years.
You should welcome these new bowlers. Let them leave the tournament with a good experience. If they feel good they will come back. Some will get better, some will stay the same. Give them credit for trying.
There are plenty of other tournaments out there that keep these bowlers out.
+1, this sense of "entitlement" has and will continue to kill bowling.
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*˙ǝɟıן ɹnoʎ ɟo spuoɔǝs ǝʌıɟ ʇsoן ʇsnɾ ǝʌɐɥ noʎ ʇɐɥʇ ʎɐs oʇ ʎɹɹos ɯɐ ı sıɥʇ pɐǝɹ noʎ ɟı
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As a former PBA member (and a marginal one at that), I can say that I bowled Tour events for the learning experience that they offer. Of course, I had the dream that if I bowled well and got some breaks, I could cash, but I knew it had to be almost a perfect storm to make that happen.
I can tell you that I cashed in almost every single regional that I bowled soon after bowling in a National stop. Bowling on a Tour shot, with the greatest bowlers in the world did help my game that much.
However, in the big picture of the PBA/USBC/BPAA (the last two for the Masters and US Open) it is all about the money that they get in entry fees and it will be that way for a long, LONG time.
Edited on 2/16/2010 2:19 PM
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Ever wonder why they are called "opens"??
It means, you can enter if you have the $$$. No pba required. No average requirements. In other words..an "open"
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Yes. it's I, the Inverted One..
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Avg is just a number that doesn't factor in any of the variables that can increase/decrease scoring pace. Our center doesn't adjust the volumes or double strip when they run the sport patterns during the summer. Sometimes they just run the shot right over top of the house pattern from earlier in the day if they have been busy.
We had a Team USA guy in our league that was under 200. Are you going to tell me that he shouldn't be allowed to bowl the Masters because he doesn't average 200 sport?
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Not too long ago, and I'm not sure if it is the same. To join the PBA they just asked either a 200 house average or 175 sport average!
That needs to be adjusted to 200 sport average and 225 house average.
My two cents.
I'd go 200 Sport Avg, 230 or even 235 THS average.
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GetOffMe10Pin
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"Why don't you call me sometime.....when you have no class" ~~Rodney Dangerfield to Sally Kellerman, his college professor in Back to School ~~1986
Mike Craig - Storm Products Pro Shop staff -Columbus, OH
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BigMike, unless they changed the rules, that summer "sport" shot would not be sport compliant. I do know what you mean though. I've bowled on 3 summer sport leagues in 3 different houses and have seen a wide variety of scoring paces. One had a few regional cashers participating and no one averaged 200 for the league.
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Penn State Proud
Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive (http://"http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm")
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If you have booked a 200+ average on a sport shot league, you can bowl with the Pro''''s.
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Put Robert Smith with those guys and he probably goes +200 for the day and makes the cut.
Robert Smith is a professional and if he can''''t hack it on any set of lanes then he should not bowl in the tournament.
I hate these kind of statements. It saying that he got cheated out of something.
Oh wait ... he was playing with a bunch of nobodies. What did they do? Screw up his line or make a mess of the oil pattern because they don''''t know how to break down a pattern correctly.
You all complain about the sport of bowling dying. And yet when new comers get aboard. You do what? Make fun at their inexperience, and laugh at their questions.
I guess you forgot how little you knew when you first started bowling tournaments. You won''''t be laughing when Tournament Entry Fees are twice the amount in 5 years and the total prize fund is less than it is now.
There are plenty of other tournaments out there that keep these bowlers out.
Your statement show how little you know about bowling on Sport/PBA conditions. Anyone that knows anything about bowling on sport/PBA conditions knows it''s all about how you break it down. You can bowl with people that don''t know what they are doing and you are at a disadvantage. Yet if you get a group that knows what they are doing, they can blow a big fat hole in it and the scores go up. That is what happened to Robert in that case, he was behind the 8 ball.
As for folks new to bowling tournaments, the Masters and the US Open are not good places to start bowling tournaments. TQRs, local tourneys and house tournaments are the place you learn. The Masters and US Open are for people that know what they are doing.
You want a fantasy camp? Bowl the Pro Am.
It would be like someone coming into your office and ripping up every other page of a presentation you were working on. Can you get it done? Sue, but not nearly as fast as me with 4 others working together on it.
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ROTO GRIP, There is NO Substitute
Slow Feet, Soft hand = Lots of strikes
Edited on 2/21/2010 5:32 PM
Edited on 2/21/2010 8:31 PM
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Your statement show how little you know about bowling on Sport/PBA conditions.
I do understand.
Again...when you make statements like this, you are stating his skills and abilities as a bowler was not enough. Robert Smith needed a hole in the pattern. Because blowing a hole in the pattern is the key to advancing in a tournament with a SPORT condition.
What ever lanes you are on. You do your best. I am sure Robert Smith did that. He is a competitor. He gives it his all out there anytime he bowls. We have seem him bowl with physical injuries. This guy is one the top bowlers in the world. The first time I saw him on TV ... I said WOW!!! I never seen anyone with the power he had.
As bowling fan I would like to state that his best that day was not enough versus you stating he needed to have his professinal buddies with him to blow a hole in the pattern.
We all have been there. Whether its professional or local tournaments. We have been placed on bad lanes or matched with people who have no clue. Whatever it is you don''t make excuses!!
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It would be like someone coming into your office and ripping up every other page of a presentation you were working on. Can you get it done? Sue, but not nearly as fast as me with 4 others working together on it.
I thought we were discussing an individual competition, not team.
Edited on 2/22/2010 9:21 AM
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You want a fantasy camp? Bowl the Pro Am.
You only want to bowl tournaments with exclusivity? Don't bowl an OPEN!