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General Category => PBA => Topic started by: th3jumpoff on December 05, 2004, 04:02:43 AM

Title: What a trick shot :O
Post by: th3jumpoff on December 05, 2004, 04:02:43 AM: lol did i see norm do what i think he did?
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Walking E on December 05, 2004, 12:03:35 PM: That's the highlight of the show so far - maybe the season!
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You weren't unlucky when you left that corner pin, so shut up about it already!!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Brunswick Kid on December 05, 2004, 12:06:25 PM: Hehe HB, shoot us a perfect game .
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--Detour Kid

Burn those heads!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: legend4life95 on December 05, 2004, 12:14:03 PM: How do you even think that up? Very cool though!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: tonybowls on December 05, 2004, 12:36:04 PM: That shot was amazing!!! He really can get a ball to do whatever it is he wants it to do.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: WrOnGwAy on December 05, 2004, 12:44:20 PM: Duke has been doing that for years. This is just the first time I've seen it on tv. He has suckered people into bowling against him for money against him using the towel and emptied there pockets.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 12:45:36 PM: From reading this thread, I tell can that no one will agree with me, but his "trick shot" was a very classless thing to do during the match. I don't care whether the result of the match was over or not. Never thought I would say something Norm Duke did something classless, but that is my feeling about this. Go bowl in the Skills Challenge if you want to do something like that. Not during the actual tournament.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: jjweb on December 05, 2004, 12:47:56 PM: Norm and Brian did a clinic here in Virginia a few months ago, and they both were doing trick shots for everyone.

But I was honored when Norm asked to use both of my towels!!!

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The bowling gods said "let there be strikes" and then there was Dyno-Thane!

Edited on 12/5/2004 1:39 PM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: WrOnGwAy on December 05, 2004, 12:49:59 PM: quote:
From reading this thread, I tell can that no one will agree with me, but his "trick shot" was a very classless thing to do during the match. I don't care whether the result of the match was over or not. Never thought I would say something Norm Duke did something classless, but that is my feeling about this. Go bowl in the Skills Challenge if you want to do something like that. Not during the actual tournament.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

The match was over, so I don't have any problems with it. I'm sure the PBA loved it though. It's getting more talk than the actual final match. Also, it's something that got people's interest back into the match when it was obviously over.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 12:50:54 PM: The fact that he wouldn't have done it against anyone else makes my point even more valid. Who cares who he was bowling??? If one would say he would do it against everyone, then so be it, but if that is not the case, it didn't belong on the show.

And I do realize that it got people talking, but it still doesn't make it okay to have been done during the match. People talk a lot about Terrell Owens' antics, but they don't belong in the NFL either. Not truly the same, but close enough.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

Edited on 12/5/2004 1:48 PM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: seadrive on December 05, 2004, 12:57:08 PM: quote:
... I tell can that no one will agree with me...

Well, at least you got that part right, teach.

If Norm had chosen to throw an illegal delivery for a zero count, because he was so far ahead in the match that he didn't need the pins, I would agree with you.

But of course, Norm being the classy guy he is, that would never happen.

The match was over, Duke and his friend Voss were putting on a little show for the fans, who appeared to enjoy it greatly.

Oh yeah, this is also the kinda stuff that gives you a chance to get your sport on SportsCenter. Maybe someone in the PBA suggested it to Norm?
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seadrive
Cogito ergo bowl
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 01:11:41 PM: If someone from the PBA actually asked him to do it, it certainly doesn't make it right either. If bowling needs to resort to having someone do trick shots during an actual competition, that is a sad, sad commentary. My point still remains that it was a classless thing to do during the actual match. Save it for the Skills Challenge.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: th3jumpoff on December 05, 2004, 01:18:03 PM: how do you know that voss didn't tell him to do it.. not starting a flame but just want to give my 2 cents
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 01:22:35 PM: Hmm, let me see. Still doesn't make a difference to me. Cheapened the match regardless of who asked him, told him, begged him, or whatever. Knowing how much he is respected in the bowling world, he should have had the sense to not do that during the competition.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: DavidKSNK on December 05, 2004, 01:52:59 PM: quote:
Hmm, let me see. Still doesn't make a difference to me. Cheapened the match regardless of who asked him, told him, begged him, or whatever. Knowing how much he is respected in the bowling world, he should have had the sense to not do that during the competition.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

You're in the minority bub.

The fans went wild for it as did I.

Most people were not thinking of it in terms of being classless.

Classless would be walking up to the foul line, putting the ball down and kicking it into the gutter. Something I have seen from some pros.

It was by far better than any of the trick shots done on the skills competition.

As everyone said, the match was over, Duke could not have won. He wanted to do something fun. Nothing wrong with that.
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Somewhere in the far distant future Lane #1's slogan will be..."Lane #1, out-carrying Storm for over 50 years!"
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 02:09:19 PM: My friend, and once again, if that is the biggest ovation this year during a telecast, a sad, sad commentary. It is not about lightening up, it is about not cheapening the sport and competition which I believe it did. You would never see someone losing in a PGA competition, hit the ball with his putter, or try to hit the ball with the other side of the club if that person was out of the match. If that happened, what would you say about that???

D,
I am not saying it wasn't an impressive thing to see, but not during an actual competition. That is the classless part. What you describe would also have been classless. One receives ovation, one gets looked at as being classless. Both are against rules. One is obvious worse looking than the other, however, they both shouldn't happen during competition. Thus my point.

You are right about one thing. It is an impressive trick and more impressive than the others I have seen. Thus, it belongs there and not in the match.

Lastly, people keep saying the match couldn't have been won. Why does that make a difference??? It shouldn't.

Okay, one for for everyone. If this would have been someone like Pete Weber who did this. What would everyone's reaction have been. Not saying he would do that, but what if he did. Would everyone's reaction be the same. Would I be in the minority on this one??? Might be interesting to know.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 02:50:08 PM: Yes and no Dirty. It only strikes a nerve a little since I find it very odd that people think it was okay and entertaining for someone to do a trick during an actual competition. The no part is that the trick shot was pretty impressive, but should be reserved to something other than compettion. How many people out there would do the same thing during a competition if they knew how to do the trick and were out of the match??? I would bet not many, but I could be wrong. Also, what would the people at the competition think about it??? Is the fact that Duke is professional making this trick okay??? Again, I truly think that if someone did this during a match at a competition not on TV, people would most likely not think it was acceptable.

And you are correct, the trash talking between Angelo and Couch went a little overboard. I see nothing wrong with saying something like "come on" out load if you are doing it to motivate yourself. But they were at each other the entire match with comments directed toward each other. I just didn't like that.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

Edited on 12/5/2004 3:43 PM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 03:34:14 PM: Dream,

So glad you had something of NO substance to add to the conversation. And please take your own advice and don't say anything at all. You obviously can't accept someone's elses opinion. I am not taking this too seriously, just bringing up another side of what happened. Making sports not fun. Actually just the opposite. I love to have fun. I just don't do it in a way that I saw on TV today. I thought it was not the right place for it.

And please don't tell me you know what kind of person I am. You have no idea and once again, you added something else to the conversation that has NO substance. Read my posts, disagree with what I said, fine. That is your choice.

Have a nice day. Hope you leave soon since you are so bothered. For myself. I have to go and bowl so I guess I will leave too. Maybe I will try to towel trick and see how much people "enjoy" I am doing that during bowling. See you.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

Edited on 12/5/2004 4:31 PM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 03:46:46 PM: Just one more before I leave. Please find me the substance in your post that told me to shut up. Not any there as far as I can see.

And no, not jealous I can't do his trick. Don't really care if I can do it or not. Maybe you should go back and read a little. I said the trick was impressive, but I just thought the match was not the place for it.

Time to go. I guess we can agree to disagree. Don't get to upset over this. It is just funny to me how you seem to be so worked up about me opinion.

See ya.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: yoder978 on December 05, 2004, 04:01:15 PM: i was at a junior/adult scratch tournament in toledo today. most of the bowlers there are highly skilled including some pros and a couple team usa and junior team usa members. that match was on the TV's at the bowling alley and many people were watching. everyone there applauded and then proceeded to have a good conversation about that shot. this is coming from what i would consider to be "THE BETTER BOWLERS" and we all thought that it was great. it will make a sportscenter top 10 and it will give the pba a few more seconds of coverage to people who do not watch bowling. therefor i think that it was not only great for the entertainment value but great for the sport.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Ernie McCracken on December 05, 2004, 04:44:31 PM: I seem to remember last year on the telecasts when they had young, pretty girls cheering and acting like they were having a great time at pro events. A lot of people said that it was a cheap way for the PBA to attract the younger and more energetic crowds. So now we get to see trick shots and nobody has a problem with it? I feel that it cheapens an already hurting sport. I get teased all the time for being a bowler by my more athletic friends. Bowling has a bad enough name already. We don't need trick shots on what is supposed to be a professional event. How many times do you see pro basketball teams pulling off tricks like the Globetrotters during game time? How many times do you see pro golfers tap their golf ball on the ends of their clubs like Tiger did in those popular Nike commercials during an event? I guess I don't see tricks in other pro competitions so why should they be in bowling? May as well just keep the continuous jokes about bowling and bowlers going.
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Evolutionary. Revolutionary.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Borincano on December 05, 2004, 05:33:54 PM: If I was Norman Duke I would also have done the shot though the back of legs.
Putting out the statement that I can bowl any which way I decide to do it an give you a run for your money. Does that do not agree may have a serious problem in how they bowl.

It was fun and has made people talking about bowling in this site.

Do again Norman Duke.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mrteach3 on December 05, 2004, 07:39:38 PM: Back from bowling.

Just to respond to a few and then I am done.

Luvs,
I truly do wonder what Voss thought of the shot. I would just rather have him finished his game and got out of the way without creating a circus atmosphere. Okay, maybe the circus atmosphere is a little much. I just would have rather him got out of the way. And I wasn't offended as much as I was disappointed that it happened in the first place. I will no doubt agree that he is one of the classiest professionals out there which is why I was surprised it happened during a match. No matter whether he was in the match or way out of it.

Lane1,
How can you still ask why??? I think I have made my point about why. In my opinion it cheapened the game, the sport, the telecast. You wouldn't see this happen in other arenas. The game of bowling already has enough problems than to see a guy throw a trick shot during the actual competition. It gives it a bad look. It just wouldn't happen other places.

yoder,
Once again, if bowling has to resort to a trick shot to make SportsCenter, that is just plain sad. It is unfortunate that a sport we all obviously love doesn't get more respect. However, trick shots during the competition is not the way to go to gain more respect in my opinion.

Ernie,
Thanks. Nice to see I am not the only one. Maybe we are the only two, but at least I am not alone.

To everyone else, except one person, thanks for your viewpoints. I read carefully and responded. That is what a forum is about. To learn, to debate, to agree, to disagree. Glad to see that most of us can stick to the topic whether or not we had the same opinion.

On edit: Sorry, didn't realize it was after the 300 chance was over. Thought it was just before.
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Who needs a 300 or 800, when I have a 294 and a 295!?!?!

Edited on 12/6/2004 6:26 AM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Laybzz74 on December 05, 2004, 08:24:46 PM: IMHO ... it was cool, very comical, and if I'm not mistaken, I believe I heard them say on the telecast that the "towel trick" is a teaching tool.
In summary, I truly believe that Norm Duke is a spontaneous, fun-loving student of this great game ... he respects the game, respects his opponents, and his fellow bowlers.

My 2 cents worth ...

Robb in 1000 Oaks
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: TwoFourEightNineNine on December 05, 2004, 08:52:57 PM: This towel trick by Norm Duke was so two years ago for me... and it was already a trick that several people knew about for years now.

A few other people can do it... I've seen Richard Shockley (formerly of Kegel) do it.
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-Jeremy Vitug

It is YOU who decides what happens on the lane.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Overhand on December 05, 2004, 09:45:16 PM: loved the towel shot; and the others i shot with tonight thought it was cool, too.

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It is by Caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion. It is by the beans of Java that my thoughts acquire speed. The hands acquire shakes, the shakes become a warning. It is by Caffeine alone that I set my mind in motion.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Borincano on December 05, 2004, 11:15:45 PM: I heard in the telecast when Duke was with Randy that Voss made the bet for $10.00 if he made a strike with the towel. So Voss was also into the towel trick. Good pals and bowlers.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: 230-n-up-or-bust on December 05, 2004, 11:44:36 PM: Although I agree with mrteach's viewpoint regarding how it sheds a negative light onto the sport in which we cherish. I believe, moreso, that "classless" was a bit too strong. Norm Duke is one of the most respected members of the bowling community and should not be condemned for a little playful activity between very good friends during a match that was mathematically impossible for Voss to have lost. There are SO many other examples of how prefessional athletes humiliate themselves, their teammates, their cities, and their sports. If this is the extent in which bowling is exploited, I'm ok with what took place. FYI, Duke performed this little stunt in the 10th frame, long after Voss left, and missed, his eight-pin in the ninth frame. I believe there are some that think this took place while Voss had the front eight.
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Pain is weakness leaving the body.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: jkiser01 on December 06, 2004, 06:10:01 AM: Norm Duke in my opinion is one of the all time greats on the PBA tour.. 22 titles and a hall of famer for sure.. When he is on the show, its always great..

In my opinion, there was nothing classless about the towel shot, I think it was great.. I also don't see where it was inappropriate.. He was having some FUN, so lighten up..

He did it against his best friend on tour when the match was OVER, so big deal.. He was having a good time and making people happy that where watching the match there and at home..

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If they only made a ball that would carry that da_n 7 pin (and I am right handed!!)

jkiser01

Edited on 12/6/2004 7:08 AM
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Reality Check on December 06, 2004, 06:36:30 AM: I agree that classless is a very poor choice of phrase to use about a highly respected and decorated sportsman. He was throwing the last shot of the game, and with nothing on the line. People are now going to talking about how this pro-bowler was so good, he managed to get a strike with his ball in a towel. I don't see how that is more classless than some guy in shoulder pads and a helmet dancing like a moron after getting a touchdown in front of his team-mates and his opposition, or a boxer flpping himself into the ring while lights, fireworks and music blast the arena.....its about showmanship, entertainment and showing the payoff for skills and talents.
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Reality Is.......Working out how to carry the 10, only to start leaving the 7.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Wylie on December 06, 2004, 07:03:43 AM: Here's my thoughts: Bowling, Golf, Football, Baseball, and every other sport is a GAME. Are they also a business, unfortunately, yes...but a GAME none the less. Last time I checked, games were meant to be FUN!?! I think it was GREAT...GO NORM!!! What's wrong with trying to put some FUN back into a GAME???
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KYLE

IF IT WILL, IT WILL...SO BE IT!!!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: JOE FALCO on December 06, 2004, 07:16:53 AM: The only thing that bothers me is .. I MISSED THE SHOW! I was in a bowling tournament .. asked the desk to put the show on .. responded with .. We're too busy to put the show on .. I asked if the show was going to interfere with them .. THE GOOD OLD SOUTH!
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Hit them light and watch them fight
J O E - F A L C O
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: jkiser01 on December 06, 2004, 07:17:24 AM: Wylie,

GREAT comment!! I totally agree with everything you just said..

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If they only made a ball that would carry that da_n 7 pin (and I am right handed!!)

jkiser01
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: johns811 on December 06, 2004, 07:33:43 AM: I think the point MrTeach3 was trying to make about the shot (although cool and actually easy to do) is it made a mockery out of the game in a professional tournament being televised.

I guess if it was the championship match and the tournament was officially over (Voss winner) maybe it would have been more appropriate. There was still one big game left and I'm don't think that was the time and place to start goofing off. Duke should have saved that for the trick shot competition. That is the time and place for that.

There is a lot of golf comparisons on this board. If a pga player pulled out some sort of illegal club and hit a shot just for the fans there would be hell to pay. Probably disqualified from the tournament and forfeit any prize money. In bowling the only penalty is 0 pins.

It was pretty cool shot, no flames please, just don't think it was the appropriate time for it.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Wylie on December 06, 2004, 07:52:18 AM: I have just 1 question....Was the shot illegal??? If not, it is a GAME!!! also, you see people (Tiger, Phil, and Ernie) Doing "Trick Shots" on tour all the time (no real difference) Remember the shot Ernie hit out of the bush limb??? The convensional shot would have been to drop and take the stroke. All I'm saying is that it is a GAME. Voss obviously loved it, so what is the big Deal??? It is a GAME...
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KYLE

IF IT WILL, IT WILL...SO BE IT!!!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Bill Thomas on December 06, 2004, 01:57:00 PM: If the PBA/ESPN publicity guys play this up right, it could become a great way to create a little buzz for our sport. Just look at what its done on this site. Were I running PBA/ESPN, I'd have the towel shot on Sportscenter and be working right now on a promo for the tour programs. If its controversial, all the better to get people talking about the PBA and bowling. Lord knows the sport needs any publicity it can get.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: iommifan on December 06, 2004, 02:07:18 PM: I think it's a win-win situation. Duke was already out, why not play to the fans? Isn't that what it's about?? I think it was Voss' idea for the bet. The PBA needs to get people interested. Showmanship is the best way. They are 2 classy guys, the only problem I had with it was Voss lost. Look at this post if you think it didn't work. It's 3 pages thick and I don't think anybody has even taken a shot at Wicked290 in this post!!
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Ragnar on December 06, 2004, 02:08:14 PM: Not to quibble over the "right or wrongness" of the towel shot; just wanted to mention that in the last match of a Swiss team tourney some years ago a Spokane pro bowled the whole game using the Towel shot - shot 211 or some such. I've since learned it myself (pretty easy really).

What I wonder is, is it really illegal? Seems to me that it might be just as legal as using a brace. Probably not though since you are using NO holes.
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"A little sincerity is a dangerous thing, and a great deal of it is absolutely fatal." Oscar Wilde
Ragnar sure likes to throw his purdy Uranium Buzzsaw.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: mumzie on December 06, 2004, 02:20:57 PM: quote:
There are SO many other examples of how prefessional athletes humiliate themselves, their teammates, their cities, and their sports. If this is the extent in which bowling is exploited, I'm ok with what took place.

Amen. At least they weren't throwing chairs at fans, or doing drugs, or raising dogs for fighting, or... or... or .... - you know - the things the "professionals" of the "real" sports like to do...
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Bowlers are like puppies. The only difference is that someday the puppy will quit whining.
-- Found at Sam's Town Pro Shop
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Wilbert on December 06, 2004, 03:36:43 PM: quote:
What I wonder is, is it really illegal? Seems to me that it might be just as legal as using a brace. Probably not though since you are using NO holes.

I think what makes it illegal is the number of holes you are allowed in a bowling ball. You are allowed gripping holes and one balance hole. Since none of the holes are used for gripping, they fall in the category of balance holes.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: jimensminger on December 06, 2004, 03:39:44 PM: 18th green, O'Meara has Woods by 3 shots,...Woods can only finish second to his good friend. Woods has about a 50 footer for par,...what's this,..he's going to putt with his driver,...O'Meara bets Wood $10 he misses,...the crowd is loving this,...Woods sinks the putt. O'Meara wins the tournament...great friends,..great stuff for golf,...
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www.dynothane.com
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: Pinbuster on December 06, 2004, 07:52:55 PM: Rule 4a. A delivery is made when the ball leaves the playerâ€™s possession and crosses the foul line into playing territory. Every delivery counts unless a dead ball is declared. (See Rule 8.) A delivery must be made entirely by manual means. No device may be incorporated in or affixed to the ball that detaches on delivery or is a moving part during delivery except as provided in Rules 4b and c.

I believe this is the rule that makes the delivery illegal. The towel is condsidered a device used for griping purposes and not required due to amputation.
Title: Re: What a trick shot :O
Post by: bowling9883 on December 06, 2004, 08:15:17 PM: That was sic dude! he's revvin faster with the towel then some juniors in my league! ha!
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Columbia plus Ebonite=300