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Author Topic: Can the PWBA survive?  (Read 30539 times)

spencerwatts

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Can the PWBA survive?
« on: July 04, 2017, 07:06:05 AM »
Does it appear that bowler interest in the PWBA is starting to wane? 

In 2015, the first year, there was talk of capacity fields at each event. And the numbers appeared to be equally as strong, if not stronger, in 2016. But the field sizes are arguably lower in 2017.

Essentially, given the cash ratio is somewhere in the 2:1 range at most events, I don't see how those numbers justify any long-term viability and success. Eventually, the sponsors that the PWBA does have will demand a better return on investment.
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JustRico

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #31 on: July 05, 2017, 11:13:55 AM »
Another issue is the varying channels bowling appears on
You have ESPN NBCsports & CBSsports
Many households barely have ESPN and the tines changes too much
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luv2C10falll

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #32 on: July 05, 2017, 11:29:45 AM »
Someone will put it on YouTube a few days after it aires on cable tv.

Luke Rosdahl

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #33 on: July 05, 2017, 11:44:44 AM »
To be up front, I like the PWBA the way it is.  Patterns are kinda brutal, but I enjoy watching the PWBA.  Mens tour, not so much.  But if we're trying to increase the viewer base, we have to make it more fun and accessible.  Yeah maybe some wrasslin' is what it needs.  Maybe seeing Rash give Belmo the Stone Cold stunner for crinkling a water bottle will increase viewers . . who knows.  All I know is there's zero reason for the average person to watch, when 20 years ago it was pretty popular.  May not have been huge, but it may just be one of those things that's really fun to do, but not fun to watch.  Forcing something to work regardless of whether that's possible or not may just be a futile endeavor.  I don't think they've done enough to even test that out though, you have two groups pulling in completely opposite directions.  You have the purists on one hand like Marshall Kent who just want it as competitive and technical and brutal as possible, and on the other hand you have the majority of the viewer base who want it easy and accessible. 

Bowling has to be the hardest sport on the planet to understand though, because to truly understand it, you almost need a degree in physics.  It's not like handing someone a stick with a weird head on it and saying hit that white ball you can see to that flag you can see avoiding obstacles you can see and accounting for weather you can see and feel.  Golf is a pretty simple and very intuitive game to play.  Bowling fights a daily battle with people who don't understand things or understands them the opposite of how they really are, and that battle will never end.  Golf is just a matter of doing, bowling has to be understood first, then there's the doing.  Bowling is about like watching a chess match, and it will always be like a chess match because the really interesting critically important stuff is all in the players minds and completely invisible.  To those that don't play or understand chess, you see guys moving some pieces around and then someone wins or loses.  Boring as hell. 

The key to enjoying bowling is interest in participation.  Once you participate and start to understand, then you can enjoy watching.  I guarantee none of us that actually watch bowling regularly got hooked on bowling by seeing it on tv, and then started playing.  Most sports are like that, true, but I've never played football in my life and I still like watching it.  Never played hockey, like watching that too.  Bowling I could never enjoy watching without doing it.  It's the doing that makes the watching interesting.  So I feel like it stands to reason that you're not going to get viewers by trying crazy things with shows to get people to watch.  You need to get them participating first, and the viewers will come from that.  But if you're doing what the Chad and all these elite bowlers are doing by putting everything so far out of reach, you're driving away potential participants before they ever have a chance to enjoy it. 

Main Event centers will do more for bowling than USBC and BPAA or the PBA or PWBA ever will, because they make it fun.  I'm probably crazy, probably wrong, but these rabbits I chase take me to some pretty weird places.  What the hell. 
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Luke Rosdahl

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #34 on: July 05, 2017, 11:48:05 AM »
Nah, the Chad shut that the hell down.  I was told explicitly by the man himself that CBS Sports was in more homes than the internet.  He very firmly believes the way to increase viewers is through obscure channels few people have.  The YouTube route they used the first year I thought was pretty successful, and to your point, I watch 75% of the shows on YouTube because I don't have a dvr, and YouTube is everywhere you've got the computer and internet. 

Someone will put it on YouTube a few days after it aires on cable tv.
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northface28

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #35 on: July 05, 2017, 11:56:19 AM »
The reality is people just don't watch bowling.  Period.  The scores being high or low is just an excuse one way or the other.

An for the average person to try and sit and watch has to brutal.  How does the person flipping the channel supposed to know what "off the spot" means.  They do a terrible job explaining the game to a viewer that might not know anything about bowling.  And the talk about the pattern this and that.  Most bowlers don't know that stuff.  They need to dumb it down a little without it being insulting.  A lot less technical.   

You do that and the purists get angry for it being "dumbed down".
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HankScorpio

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #36 on: July 05, 2017, 11:58:39 AM »


Bowling has to be the hardest sport on the planet to understand though, because to truly understand it, you almost need a degree in physics.  It's not like handing someone a stick with a weird head on it and saying hit that white ball you can see to that flag you can see avoiding obstacles you can see and accounting for weather you can see and feel.  Golf is a pretty simple and very intuitive game to play.  Bowling fights a daily battle with people who don't understand things or understands them the opposite of how they really are, and that battle will never end.  Golf is just a matter of doing, bowling has to be understood first, then there's the doing.  Bowling is about like watching a chess match, and it will always be like a chess match because the really interesting critically important stuff is all in the players minds and completely invisible.  To those that don't play or understand chess, you see guys moving some pieces around and then someone wins or loses.  Boring as hell. 


Thank you. I have always hated the comparison to golf for TV viewership. Yes, they are both individual, repetition sports. The comparisons end there.

Golf is an easy to watch and understand sport. Good shots are obvious. Bad shots are obvious. When a putt is hard, it's obvious. Even the untrained eye of my wife can see a putt be carried away by a hill. Watching golf is visual.

Bowling is the exact opposite. Strikes are the expectation, and they can be had with good shots and bad shots. Bad results aren't always due to bad shots. To a non-bowler, watching EJ Tackett struggle this week on TV was the result of him being a bad bowler (as noted by the, again, untrained eye of my wife). Of course he's not a bad bowler, but you can't see the obstacles in bowling and most have no idea that there is even oil on the lane. Watching bowling is mental, you have to understand it to enjoy it.

I compare bowling much more to watching something like  cycling on TV. Cyclists have strategies they use in a race, but I couldn't tell you any of them and I wouldn't notice a good move watching it by myself.  Therefore, I don't watch it.

Luke Rosdahl

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #37 on: July 05, 2017, 12:02:10 PM »
The purists could all quit bowling and it wouldn't be a drop in the bucket though, but of course you know that.  Quite ironic that the people who care about "bowling" the most are the ones killing it. 

The reality is people just don't watch bowling.  Period.  The scores being high or low is just an excuse one way or the other.

An for the average person to try and sit and watch has to brutal.  How does the person flipping the channel supposed to know what "off the spot" means.  They do a terrible job explaining the game to a viewer that might not know anything about bowling.  And the talk about the pattern this and that.  Most bowlers don't know that stuff.  They need to dumb it down a little without it being insulting.  A lot less technical.   

You do that and the purists get angry for it being "dumbed down".
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Freddy

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #38 on: July 05, 2017, 12:37:59 PM »
Luke Rosdahl,   Well said!!!! 

Freddy

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #39 on: July 05, 2017, 12:42:50 PM »
Part of the problem is not all ladies bowl the entire PWBA summer season.  Alot of ladies bowl for their home countries.  They bowl in events during this time. 

itsallaboutme

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #40 on: July 05, 2017, 01:50:37 PM »
The purist can be angry, but they will still watch.  Just like they bitch non stop on golfwrx about Johnny Miller and other announcers, but they still watch. 

When I was flipping through channels and came to America's Cup within 10 minutes of watching they were describing why the boat was up in the air and why the grinders were going nonstop.  Otherwise I'd be sitting there going wtf are they doing.

BowlingforSoup

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #41 on: July 05, 2017, 03:02:48 PM »
 The PBA needs more PDW if hes on a show I am watching .The Main event shows are terrible.25 people in the crowd afraid to make a sound.The bowlers didn't act like they even cared to be there.

 Hell for 30 grand I am ready to rip your throat out.I like the days of old none of this high five crap after every pitch.Guys with the gay ass hugs after a match.Its a payday and I taking it from you is my approach.

  Luke mentioned Chris Barnes I cant stand the arrogant guy.I watch him to watch him choke.Guy thinks he never throws a bad shot.Boring is his middle name.I dont understand when Microsoft bought the PBA they were telling PDW do whatever to create some excitement.He did just that for years he was always doing something that was talked about.

  Someone needs to build a fire under these guys asses.Watch old shows of Marshall Holman you think hes going to hug you after he kicks your ass.The PBA needs some more like PDW.If I had the talent of Jesper almost unbeatable when hes lined up.I would be talking so much smack nobody would want to bowl me.Excuse my french but the PBA has become Pu...fied.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2017, 03:26:06 PM by BowlingforSoup »

JustRico

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #42 on: July 05, 2017, 03:10:46 PM »
Bowling in a nutshell...take golf, how would you explain to a person void of sight, wind or rain?
  All while playing the game in front of them, in which they are unable to see?
  This would be comparable to explaining bowling and ball motion to a layperson.
  Another example would be playing tennis, with needing to hit a tennis ball inside lines that are constantly moving & changing, on every hit of the tennis ball; along with the player being unable to see the lines.
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JazlarVonSteich

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #43 on: July 05, 2017, 03:51:20 PM »
This just popped on in my facebook feed: https://www.facebook.com/OuterRimProductions/videos/10155508306239660/

So about those major changes...

mainzer

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #44 on: July 05, 2017, 03:58:12 PM »
Well stated Luke. I have said it before and I will say it now. The only problem with Bowling is the bowlers


The purists could all quit bowling and it wouldn't be a drop in the bucket though, but of course you know that.  Quite ironic that the people who care about "bowling" the most are the ones killing it. 

The reality is people just don't watch bowling.  Period.  The scores being high or low is just an excuse one way or the other.

An for the average person to try and sit and watch has to brutal.  How does the person flipping the channel supposed to know what "off the spot" means.  They do a terrible job explaining the game to a viewer that might not know anything about bowling.  And the talk about the pattern this and that.  Most bowlers don't know that stuff.  They need to dumb it down a little without it being insulting.  A lot less technical.   

You do that and the purists get angry for it being "dumbed down".
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MainzerPower

BowlingforSoup

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Re: Can the PWBA survive?
« Reply #45 on: July 05, 2017, 04:51:27 PM »
Haha American Ninja Bowling see how easy bowling is a Ninja 300.