Author Topic: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go! (Read 3969 times)

mumzie · « **on:** February 25, 2004, 10:00:26 AM »

First of all - ESPN is owned by Disney.
Therefore, as far as I'm concerned, there's a boycott at the mouse house.
When I write my letters, I will write them to Disney as well as ESPN.

Here's a link discussing ESPN, Disney, and a bunch of "favorable reviews" broadcast on ESPN regarding a Disney movie (surprise, huh?).
http://www.canuckscorner.com/weblog/nhllog/archives/000440.html

Here's another link posted by kenzone regarding giving feedback to ESPN by joining their viewer network:
http://www.espnviewerzone.com

I don't really think anyone can save the PWBA at this point, but if enough of us contact these mega corporations, maybe we can get something next time.

Edited on 2/26/2004 1:55 AM

Buck Silverado · « **Reply #1 on:** February 26, 2004, 11:45:09 AM »

Rack, what exactly do you not understand about this discussion? Or are you a major ESPN/Disney stockholder or employee?

It was the discussions with ESPN, and their unwillingness to to work out an agreement with the prospective buyer of the remains of the PWBA, that just doomed the PWBA.

This isn't about just picking on poor old little 'ol ESPN for fun.

All that is being advocated here is letting ESPN and it's owner Disney, know how the recreational and professional bowling community at large feels about their decision. A tremendous amount of people bowl in this country. If the Disney people felt that all those folks might not want to spend money on Disney products, store, movies, or at Disney resorts, it just might tend to change their minds a tad.

Tell them how you feel first folks, then vote with your pocketbooks. It works real well. The bottom line always gets noticed in the long run.

Personally I don't care one dang bit about what happens to ESPN or Disney, but I'm very closely associated to someone that has just had her entire life screwed up by what has happened with the 2003/2004 tour.

For someone who has had their professional bowling dreams undermined, then shattered, the PWBA's demise is not a minor inconvenience. It is a major setback. Those few very privileged top ranking pro's seem to be the only one's that get any lip service. I've read the many cute little stories about the few...and how they've gone into this & that business due to the tour ending. It's all about them...at least in their privileged minds...WRONG!

The PWBA Tour coming to an end shattered the dreams of many hundreds if not thousands of up & coming young juniors and collegiate bowlers. Not to mention all those legions of ladies who would just like to give it a try to see if they could be their best...at least for a while.

Sorry Rack...ya just don't seem to get it.

We owe it to these ladies to write letters and send emails to see if anyone listens. Remember all these women put a lot of money, time nd effort into our (combined) sport. That helps to keep the centers open, which in turn makes it so that we all have somewhere to take our equipment to have fun. No one sector of our sport is more or less important than any other.

It takes the combined effort of all of us to make bowling what it is. This prevalent Men's Tour is better than the Women's Tour mentality (BS) will in the long run diminish what the sport can become.
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"De Oppresso Liber"

Steven · « **Reply #2 on:** February 26, 2004, 12:29:17 PM »

quote:
All that is being advocated here is letting ESPN and it's owner Disney, know how the recreational and professional bowling community at large feels about their decision.

The bowling community should have have made their "feelings" known by watching the PWBA telecasts in sufficient numbers. Networks make their living by generating the ratings necessary to attract sponsors. Insufficient Ratings = Lack of Sponsorship = Low revenue = No show. It's really quite simple; business is about maximizing profit -- not by soothing the feelings of folks who now have to get a real day job.

quote:
Sorry Rack...ya just don't seem to get it.

Actually, Rack get's it, and Buck doesn't. Stop the boycott Disney nonsense. If posters here want a woman's tour, get off your rears and make it happen -- put skin in the game by forming a new PWBA business. That means investing, marketing, and doing a lot of hard work. It's always easy to spend other people's money. It's a different story when it's your own.

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"You want the truth? -- You can't handle the truth! "

Kid Jete · « **Reply #3 on:** February 26, 2004, 12:35:47 PM »

Television is all about ratings...

Make the PWBA into a reality show and maybe the ratings will attract sponsors.

Buck Silverado · « **Reply #4 on:** February 26, 2004, 12:46:13 PM »

Let's just try this one more time.

I did not say boycott.

I did not say the the big bad company was to blame.

I did not imply to "not" start a brand new association.

What I was saying...is...simply support bowling!

Geeesch is that too hard to understand.

Gadzooks Bowlboy, I get the feeling that if it had been the men's tour that had just been cut off that you guys would have a whole different take on this subject.

Of course the women and anyone seriously else interested in starting something new & hopefully improved (for a profit or otherwise) should go out and run with it.

Obviously from those posts, I'm talking to folks that only care about themselves.

No Steven..."Buck get's it".

Do you support womans bowling?

Or is bowling only about you?
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"De Oppresso Liber"

Nodsleinad · « **Reply #5 on:** February 26, 2004, 01:01:11 PM »

I wanted to be a Professional Bowling Ball Reviewer but ESPN wouldn't purchase the TV rights so now I am boycotting those rats for ruining my dreams.

Steven · « **Reply #6 on:** February 26, 2004, 01:14:18 PM »

quote:
Do you support womans bowling?

Actually, I watched the PWBA telecasts almost every week. I'm not afraid the admit that the general woman's game is close to my style, so I really enjoyed watching their tour. So in the most financially meaningful measure of 'support', I guess I did.

quote:
Or is bowling only about you?

I'm not sure what this means. Bowling is not a "life or death" activity, so I guess whatever level of participation I choose will be about me. I do coach juniors and otherwise help out at local tournaments, but I'm not sure what bearing that has here.

quote:
No Steven..."Buck get's it".

Well Buck, if you 'get it', you ultimately understand that 'support' means doing what's necessary to keep an enterprise economically viable while it's still in existence. Letters and e-mails after the fact are cute and probably give you warm and fuzzies while doing it, but at this point they have absolutely zero value.

I personally prefer devoting energy to activities that have a chance of yielding real results, and try to encourage others to do the same. Life is too short run around in circles. So again, for those here want a PWBA like tour again, take personal responsibility and make it happen. That might be your only real chance to ever see women bowlers on the air waves again.

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"You want the truth? -- You can't handle the truth! "

Edited on 2/26/2004 2:10 PM

Buck Silverado · « **Reply #7 on:** February 26, 2004, 01:27:15 PM »

Steven,

I supported the PWBA very strongly for the fast few years.

I'm very sad to see it end. I would be very happy to see something better take it's place or fill the loss.

Where I feel the worst though, is for all those that are just coming up in the sport. Right now they have no target to aim for. When the Men's tour is the only thing out there of major significance, they have no ring to chase after.

Ours is a very splitered sport. Most men take little or no interest in what the women had/have as goals. That is the part that I have never understood, because over the long haul, what's good for one gets even better if all in involved and promoting each other.

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"De Oppresso Liber"

card79 · « **Reply #8 on:** February 26, 2004, 01:39:42 PM »

I loved watching the women bowl, but why is this being turned into a men versus women thing. Would it make everyone feel better if the men had no tour either. I actually preferred the womens telecast to the mens apparently though not enough people did. I think rather than finger pointing maybe efforts should be made to support those that have lost out and encourage those coming along.

Buck you are very personally invested I can see that, but see the reality. It failed once why should espn just jump in there for free and help them out. They want their money too. I guess if I was them I would be thinking of the lost revenue from last year when they had to show table billiard reruns instead of the tour they were supposed to be showing. Maybe they are using the old do me wrong once shame on you do me wrong twice shame on me theory. They are going to get their profit no matter what.

I don't know and I don't know if any of us do. I think if you would like to write letters to espn then please do, but realize one thing they are a for profit group. PBS is the only broadcast station I know of that does not attempt to make a profit. While their actions may seen to rob a few of their dreams and living maybe they are more importantly trying to insure the dreams and living of their employees and stock holders.

I hope that a new tour starts and it works well, but have an open mind to the whole situation.
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I don't really play cards and I am not 79, but it fits together somehow.

It's a 106 miles to Chicago. We've got a full tank of gas, half a pack of cigarettes, it's dark and we're wearing sunglasses.

Steven · « **Reply #9 on:** February 26, 2004, 01:47:20 PM »

Buck: Regardless of how I come across, I will miss PWBA too. Despite what a lot of guys say about wanting to watch the PWBA because some of the players are "hot", they too enjoy watching the action because it's quality bowling. One of my scratch leagues has a few PWBA players in it, and these women are good -- they can hang with just about anyone in the area.

For what it's worth, here are a few observations. The "new" PBA with it's 50 exempt slots next year will shut out all except an elite few. The men might have something to shoot for, but at least in the short term the odds for men with the dream are slim at best.

On the bright side, I honestly believe that the PBA will eventually present opportunities for the woman. There is a market here -- it just has to be exploited at the right time under the right circumstances. It might be combining the women with the PBA Senior tour, or some other inventive way to assimilate the ladies with the men.

But I have to believe it will happen because there is money to be made, and dreams aside, that's what drives it all.

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"You want the truth? -- You can't handle the truth! "

mumzie · « **Reply #10 on:** February 26, 2004, 07:19:51 PM »

Ok. I made the original topic post. And here was my thinking - there is another thread in this forum that was asking for members of this site to write espn and "give 'em a piece of their minds"... That thread had contact info buried deep down in the topic.

I brought it up into another topic post, to get some attention. The word "boycott", although used by me, was first used in the other thread. I just thought it interesting that ultimately the PWBA was taken down by Mickey Mouse.

And - the PWBA paid approx. $40K per telecast last year. This year ESPN wanted to up that cost to $165K per show, and not guarantee any regular time slot, but guarantee television on ESPN2, not ESPN. Steve Sanders had stepped up to purchase the organization, but was savvy enough to make his purchase (thanks, Steve, for trying!!!) contingent on a satisfactory contract with ESPN.
I think that upping the cost by 4X is ridiculous - and THAT is what brought about the final demise of the PWBA.

Hope I have been able to clear a few things up.

tenten · « **Reply #11 on:** February 26, 2004, 08:18:49 PM »

My dad works for the mouse

I don't think the mouse had anything to do with it.

channel surfer · « **Reply #12 on:** February 26, 2004, 08:58:49 PM »

Do you want to know why the tour crashed??

1. Lack of bowlers

It was pretty much the same girls bowling every week, after awhile it just gets old. People wanted to see a variety of bowlers.

2. Dress Code

Lets admit it.. They're woman. I'm sure they would open to men if they would dress more in a.. well.. you know..

3. Lack of Entertainment

Unlike the PBA, the woman showed no excitement, nor did they pump up the crowd. They got up off the chair, threw the ball down the lane, sat back down. Thats it. No one saw any entertainment.

4. Lack of Advertising

Never saw any type of advertising for the womans tour.

Overall, since the participation in WPBA was low, this is what really bought them down.

Just my thoughts.

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Kid Jete · « **Reply #13 on:** February 26, 2004, 09:09:31 PM »

Why do the events have to be televised? There are hundreds of smaller tours for various sports that get no tv time at all. If people want the PWBA around work harder to get a few sponsors and go from there. Yeah the tourny purses might suck but atleast there'll be something. It's not like many of those women made the PWBA their full time job. Obviously it's rough for a woman's professional sport to make any money... other than the LPGA, WNBA, and tennis they don't have much. TV ratings stink for women's sports it's no surprise to anyone. Maybe years dopwn the road people will find them more exciting but for now you just have to live with the fact that men's sports are the money makers.

michelle · « **Reply #14 on:** February 27, 2004, 09:45:28 AM »

quote:
Do you want to know why the tour crashed??

your scratching of the surface is not unlike blind hogs hunting for food...every now and then an acorn will appear.

quote:
1. Lack of bowlers

It was pretty much the same girls bowling every week, after awhile it just gets old. People wanted to see a variety of bowlers.

There is a fair amount of talent at the regional level, but it simply was not cost effective for some of them to go out on the national level...last year was the first year in a while where the 24th place check did something more than cover expenses for someone that might have to drill up new equipment. Add in the fact that we knew the national tour was on shaky ground before the season opened and you had a situation where most chose to stay home with whatever job they had with guaranteed income. Trying to bowl a national stop and then go home the next week is always a hit and miss proposition, and going on the road even for a month is something that takes time to adjust to as well...

The net result was that those who had been out there for a while continued to stay at the top.

quote:
2. Dress Code

Lets admit it.. They're woman. I'm sure they would open to men if they would dress more in a.. well.. you know..

The dress code did have some easing last year...the pantyhose and shorts requirement was removed. But not everyone feels comfortable dressing in a provocative manner, especially when they are trying to earn their living. Most of the people I met that came out to watch were not there for a skin show.

quote:
3. Lack of Entertainment

Unlike the PBA, the woman showed no excitement, nor did they pump up the crowd. They got up off the chair, threw the ball down the lane, sat back down. Thats it. No one saw any entertainment.

4. Lack of Advertising

Never saw any type of advertising for the womans tour.

Entertainment is in the eye of the beholder. There is a lot that I'm not going to go into in this forum that contributed to some of the problems with the show and marketing. Unfortunately, those issues are going to linger even with the source of some of the problems having been out of the picture.

As to getting up, throwing the ball and sitting down...this is different from some of the PBA guys in what manner?

quote:
Overall, since the participation in WPBA was low, this is what really bought them down.

Actually I thought the womens billiards group was still doing OK...at least they still have a workable television contract.

As to kidjete, the television is necessary to attract significant sponsors. Sports that did not have the media exposure have seen leagues come and go...softball was one that comes to mind. Without the sponsors, there is no money to continue as a viable entity...getting the sponsors requires two main things- media exposure and a competent marketing director.

Author Topic: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go! (Read 3969 times)

mumzie

For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Buck Silverado

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Steven

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Kid Jete

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Buck Silverado

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Nodsleinad

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Steven

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Buck Silverado

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

card79

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Steven

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

mumzie

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

tenten

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

channel surfer

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

Kid Jete

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!

michelle

Re: For those who want to reach ESPN regarding the PWBA - here you go!