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Author Topic: Need Idea's  (Read 1839 times)

sims_37s

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Need Idea's
« on: December 11, 2008, 11:01:38 AM »
Just recieved an agent, double agent, and special agent. agent and special agent were drilled label before. I'm a typical down and in player like to play 4 boards left of center and play up 10. Problem is I just moved to this area, I've played wood lanes the last 5 years with plenty of backend where I could swing if need be. But here on the monday night league I can't get anything to hook, carry down would be an understatement even spare shots absouletely suck in this house. normally a 195 to 200 average, I can't get past 175 in this house. Averaging 195 on friday nights. any ideas would be helpful, looking for layouts primarily.

Thank you in advance

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Stever5000

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #1 on: December 11, 2008, 07:25:06 PM »
Stop trying to force it.  Play more direct angles into the pocket, and shoot straight at spares.

One of the biggest mistakes one can make on carry down is trying to overhook the ball.

sims_37s

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #2 on: December 11, 2008, 07:34:01 PM »
I have been throwing a spare ball at spares, I just keep chopping multi pin spares. I have been playing with feet five boards right of center, and babying the ball up 10 I can get it to the pocket just have no drive what so ever. I bought the lev to fix this, but everyone in the house struggles up 10 and even out to 5 most people say their average is down 20 pins. I'm not the only one struggling was hoping I might be able to use a drilling to compensate a little bit.
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Lev rg
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Dan Belcher

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #3 on: December 11, 2008, 07:50:27 PM »
First off, don't be afraid to get away from the 10 board.  But in the case of higher oil volumes and lots of carrydown, you need to make sure you concentrate NOT on hook, but instead on creating heavy roll.  Putting more rotation on the ball is just going to make it skate through oil more as it searches for dry boards to make its move.  Instead, get your hand under the ball and keep your hand behind it more, which will make it tumble a little more end-over-end.

Take a look at this video of Norm Duke using two different releases.  (Fast forward to the 2:14 mark).  You can see the difference in how his hand comes out of the ball when playing the lanes more direct and when he moves inside to swing it.  You get less change of direction, but more and earlier roll when you keep your hand behind the ball more, which will create much better pin action when facing oilier conditions.

Also, spend some time with a coach if you can.  If you're chopping lots of multi-pin spares, it's partly because you're leaving lots of multi-pin spares.  A good coach should have some pointers for your specific game and some good practice drills that will improve your accuracy and consistency.

sims_37s

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #4 on: December 11, 2008, 08:02:31 PM »
this house is the only house i have an issue with when it comes to spare shoting. spare's are quite honestly the stronger part of my game.

any drilling ideas for the agent's? all are plugged just waiting for me to decide.

thanks for the video

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Lev rg
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Stever5000

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #5 on: December 11, 2008, 08:04:24 PM »
Are the lanes flooded so you never get any reaction?  Or are they so dry that your ball dies?  If it is a THS, playing up 10 should be fine, assuming you know halfway what you're doing.

I still assume your multi-pin spares are from overworking the ball, though.  Generally, when you flag the headpin to the left, your instincts tell you that you have to hook the ball more.  So you put a little more hand in it, and next thing you know the ball never moves.  The first few things I learned about bowling on carrydown when I first switched to synthetics are a) I hate the spontaneity. b) The harder I try, the lower my scores (again, overworking myself and the bowling ball.) and c) Aside from convincing the staff to give you a freshly ran shot, there is no magical coverstock, core, layout, pitch, or surface preparation that negates or remedies extreme carrydown.

I suggest experimenting during practice.  Try a few different things step outside the box a little bit.  Try to find something that is a little more effective without sacrificing comfort, and work your way up from there.  With confidence, you'll get it.

sims_37s

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #6 on: December 11, 2008, 08:09:48 PM »
flooded. I have been bowling for 16 years now, and have never seen a house put out a shot like this every week. but I guess we all have to deal with it the same. Thanks for advice.
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Lev rg
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FrontTwelv

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #7 on: December 12, 2008, 06:15:04 AM »
back on topic...
agent:  do a 5 x 4 drilling, keep the pin below fingers
special:  do a 4 1/2 x 4 drilling, pin up
double: throw it away    or stack it @ 4" and put a weight hole on VAL and bring weight back to 1/4 side
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Drew Jordan
Columbus, OH
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EdKramarcak

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #8 on: December 12, 2008, 09:22:48 AM »
^^^^
Yeah, cuz everyone knows 1/4 of 1 ounce makes a HUGE difference in a ball with a 7 pound core.......

That is like 0.0022321% of the cores mass

HUGE DIFFERENCE


Also, you better stack it, cuz there is a HUGE difference is said balls high RG and its low RG.......

HUGE DIFFERENCE


Edited on 12/12/2008 10:24 AM

Monster Pike

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #9 on: December 12, 2008, 09:30:46 AM »
sims_37s:  Won't give you coaching advice (**rolls eyes at others**) I know you're looking for layout help, can't really help you to much there except ask the higher avg. guys what their layouts are or the pro that works there for recommendations. But how about the coverstock prep?  Have you tried taking down the finishes of the arsenal you're throwing? Knocking the polish or lane shine off? Or polishing them or whatever it is causing your lack of hook?  Just a suggestion that maybe you didn't try. If you did, then disregard.
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"The last time I saw a mouth like that, it had a hook in it." Rodney Dangerfield



Edited on 12/12/2008 11:40 AM

sims_37s

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #10 on: December 12, 2008, 10:52:10 AM »
going today to lay things out. I have played with the coverstocks a little bit, but really haven't had much experience there. thank you for the help. thanks front tweleve it's kind of what I was thinking as far as lay outs. Haven't talked to the pro shop guy yet, but will today.
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Lev rg
Dirty bomb
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Diablo
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Dan Belcher

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #11 on: December 12, 2008, 12:27:31 PM »
quote:
sims_37s:  Won't give you coaching advice (**rolls eyes at others**) I know you're looking for layout help, can't really help you to much there except ask the higher avg. guys what their layouts are or the pro that works there for recommendations. But how about the coverstock prep?  Have you tried taking down the finishes of the arsenal you're throwing? Knocking the polish or lane shine off? Or polishing them or whatever it is causing your lack of hook?  Just a suggestion that maybe you didn't try. If you did, then disregard.
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"The last time I saw a mouth like that, it had a hook in it." Rodney Dangerfield
Having the right equipment is only a small part of the battle.  If more people realized that, they'd be a lot better off.  

sims_37s

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #12 on: December 12, 2008, 07:29:39 PM »
I understand that.  but when you move from wood to synthetic lanes where the backends are completly different how does that not justify a change in some of the equipment? i've been able to change my normal line and shot respectable in the one house, as previously stated I'm just having major issues in the house with carrydown. It's pretty sad when you see the ball make it's break than hit a oil spot and just slide out. Notice I said slide out, the ball is not just rolling out because there were 3 others playing the same line all the same result. Played the spare ball straight through it, and shot 208 maybe that's the way  to play this house. lol
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Lev rg
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Dan Belcher

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Re: Need Idea's
« Reply #13 on: December 13, 2008, 09:17:38 AM »
You usually need stronger equipment on oiler synthetic lanes, yes, but also I throw the ball VERY differently on wood lanes than I do on synthetic.  On synthetic, I have keep my hand very free and open and just roll it out onto the lane, let the ball do the work.  On wood, I have to add a little extra hit at the bottom to create a little more skid through the heads and a little more grab on the backend.  Synthetic lanes encourage skid through the heads when you have fresh oil out there, so you generally need to modify your release to accomodate that.  That's why I see a lot of people that carry well in wood houses that leave flat 10s galore in synthetic houses, and vise versa.