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Author Topic: um... wtf!? help plz  (Read 6525 times)

milkshake227

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um... wtf!? help plz
« on: December 19, 2007, 05:02:00 AM »
so i got some coaching and my coach recommended an attitude shift, but my mom being the cheapskate she is decided to order online at bowling.com

well it came today and this is what it looks like

ive never seen a ball like that before, is it okay? do i need to send it back?

http://img99.imageshack.us/img99/2866/attitudeshiftro9.jpg
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shelley

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #16 on: December 19, 2007, 02:13:49 PM »
2.5oz top isn't bad.  You can still do a pin-up drilling, even one with a shorter pin buffer.  You'll just need a weight hole.  It's nothing that cannot be dealt with.  You should confirm the CG location before you start, though.

You might not be able to lay it out with the pin over the fingers as you'll have a lot of finger weight (even then it may not be that much trouble), but if you're looking for something for tougher shots and sport shots that's drilled aggressively, I doubt a high-pin with a longer pin-to-PAP distance is what you're going for anyway.

It would not be my first choice but I don't see a big problem unless the top weight is mis-marked and turns out to be higher.

SH
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Jim12387

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #17 on: December 19, 2007, 02:19:57 PM »
my prior statement still holds. a gift is a gift, and I am assuming your mom has no idea about pin placement and cg's and mb's so I would say you got a good present.

To get back on topic, the ball should work fine with that short of a cg. In an assymetric ball the MB is more important anyways. You should enjoy the ball, it is a very nice piece of equipment.

To get off topic, one christmas about 8 years ago when I was 12 my present was my parents telling me they were getting a divorce on christmas day. The christmas before that someone stole my dog on christmas day. Yeah, bad times for me i guess. Consider your gift a great one!

Have fun with the ball, shoot some big scores!
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Jim Bosse
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milkshake227

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #18 on: December 19, 2007, 02:21:22 PM »
i do, dont get me wrong, im not ACTUALLY mad at my mom, i was just sayin.
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Monster Pike

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #19 on: December 19, 2007, 03:12:05 PM »
Milkshake, please keep us posted as to what comes of this.  I've also wondered about balls on websites that don't offer pin placements in the drop down lists.  Some will let you post items like that in a special request box, but may delay shipping.  I guess next time tell your mom or significants what your specs are on your Christmas/B-day wish lists.  Good luck & let us know if you send the ball back or keep it & the layout.  Thanks.
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Just grip it & rip it!
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Borincano

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #20 on: December 19, 2007, 03:26:21 PM »
In this type of bowling ball. Do we need to concentrate on the pin and the mass bias for a good layout.
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shelley

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #21 on: December 19, 2007, 03:47:10 PM »
quote:
In this type of bowling ball. Do we need to concentrate on the pin and the mass bias for a good layout.


On a strong asymmetric like the Attitude Shift, you'd use the pin and MB to lay the ball out.  "Concentrating" on them is a good way to put it, but the CG cannot be ignored.  The ball still has to be legal when you're done and the CG can make that hard or easy or impossible.  You may be able to ignore the CG for reaction purposes but you can't dismiss it entirely.

SH
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bigb4life

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #22 on: December 19, 2007, 03:59:22 PM »
Correct me if i am wrong but can't you just drill the fingers deeper to take top weight out of the ball and still have a pin up drilling?
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Curt_Dupre

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #23 on: December 19, 2007, 04:15:17 PM »
Looking at the ball with that pin I wouldn't even take a chance to try to put the pin above the fingers. Even if you put it above and drilled the fingers way down to make it legal I think it will make it roll funny. Put the pin 4 inches from PAP try to put a 3 inch pin buffer on it with the mass bias at 55 degrees. You may have to put a hole in the side. This layout should put the pin below your fingers and it should give you a control arc on the backend. If anyone has any more input on this it would be appreciated. This is just my opinion.
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Curt_Dupre

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #24 on: December 19, 2007, 04:18:40 PM »
Also a lot of mass bias bowling balls will never come with a pro-cg because the cg doesn't matter according to them. The only thing it matters to is static weights. That is the problem with the USBC is that if the cg doesn't matter on mass bias bowling balls then why have static weights.
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CPA

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #25 on: December 19, 2007, 04:27:31 PM »
Talk with your coach and driller and he/she can help you determine what layout and surface gives you the reaction you are looking for.
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Borincano

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #26 on: December 19, 2007, 08:38:53 PM »
Thanks Shelley for the input and to look also at the side weight. If it was me a will put the pin 4 inches from the PAP and the MB at 3 1/2 and the a balance hole at the below the midline towards the thumb cuadrant. What are your thoughts?


quote:
quote:
In this type of bowling ball. Do we need to concentrate on the pin and the mass bias for a good layout.


On a strong asymmetric like the Attitude Shift, you'd use the pin and MB to lay the ball out.  "Concentrating" on them is a good way to put it, but the CG cannot be ignored.  The ball still has to be legal when you're done and the CG can make that hard or easy or impossible.  You may be able to ignore the CG for reaction purposes but you can't dismiss it entirely.

SH
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milkshake227

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #27 on: December 19, 2007, 09:30:57 PM »
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shelley

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #28 on: December 20, 2007, 06:07:17 AM »
quote:
Thanks Shelley for the input and to look also at the side weight. If it was me a will put the pin 4 inches from the PAP and the MB at 3 1/2 and the a balance hole at the below the midline towards the thumb cuadrant. What are your thoughts?


You don't really mention how high the pin is, but I'm guessing that it will be above the midline.  Then the CG will probably also be above the midline and putting a hole in the thumb quadrant will add finger weight.  With the CG already on the finger side of the ball, maybe, maybe that's a problem.  You'd have to weigh it out to see before adding the balance hole.  I would guess (I'm not a driller) that you'd need to put the balance hole above the midline.

If that picture you posted is the 4 x 3 1/2 you're talking about here, I don't see why you can't do it.  It looks like it starts with a shorter pin anyway.  You'll just have to be certain of where you put the weight hole.

SH
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shelley

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #29 on: December 20, 2007, 06:08:25 AM »
quote:
Also a lot of mass bias bowling balls will never come with a pro-cg because the cg doesn't matter according to them. The only thing it matters to is static weights. That is the problem with the USBC is that if the cg doesn't matter on mass bias bowling balls then why have static weights.


Actually, only mass bias balls can come pro-CG, as being pro-CG means that the CG is significantly off the pin-MB line.  No MB on a symmetric ball means the CG can't be off the pin-MB line.  

SH
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tommygn

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Re: um... wtf!? help plz
« Reply #30 on: December 20, 2007, 07:03:15 AM »
After looking at the picture of both the ball and the layout you want, you will be fine with this ball. Because of the lower top weight, you may not even need a balance hole. As long as you keep the pin bellow the fingers (which is one of the things you would want for a control ball for heavier volume sport patterns) you will be fine.
The only way I would recommend sending the ball back, is if you throw the ball very hard without many revolutions. The reason I say this, is because you will need to have alot of surface on the ball to keep the ball from going through the break point. With the shorter pin, you will not get as much backend with this ball with alot of surface, as you would with a 2-3 pin ball. Even though it is a mass bias ball, The pin in means that the core is positioned towards the middle of the ball, giving you easier revs in the front part of the lane. When a ball has the pin farther out, the weight block is "offset" more and away from the center of the ball, giving you more motion later down the lane.
That is one more reason to check with your local certified coach or pro shop operator to make sure this ball is a fit for your game.

Tommy Gollick
East region Storm staffer and pro shop operator
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