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Author Topic: Virtual Energy Problems  (Read 1674 times)

bowler072790

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Virtual Energy Problems
« on: September 14, 2009, 01:51:43 PM »
I drilled it up Friday with a 5x3 layout. This put the pin above my bridge, the cg below my ring finger, and the MB in a strong position. Im a cranker and throw the ball between 17 and 18 mph. At box finish, the ball rolled out. I put it at 4000 with polish but that made it way to flippy and I had problems controlling the break. So I brought it down to 2000 with polish and it rolls out again. Any suggestions on my next move????
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bowler072790

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #1 on: September 14, 2009, 09:57:44 PM »
I believe its 4 5/8 right 7/8 up and there is no weight hole.
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slashrr69

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #2 on: September 15, 2009, 12:38:46 AM »
before putting any holes in it try 4000 dry with dry buff first/no polish.. this should smooth the ball out still having a good strong backend(not flippy).. if you still see alittle too much roll out, then try 4000 with water only/no polish..
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riggs

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #3 on: September 15, 2009, 08:14:24 AM »
Static weights are about 2-3 percent of ball reaction -- just make sure it's legal. (USBC ball motion study showed that -- coverstock surface charactertistics are the dominant factors by a wide margin.)

I would question whether you are using the VE on a condition suited to it for your game.  On certain conditions with your game that is simply the ball reaction scenarios you will have.
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tommygn

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #4 on: September 15, 2009, 08:38:39 AM »
First thing, why not 4000 with no polish??

Second, I don't have a ball in front of me, so I may not be 100% correct, but I think that a 5" pin, and 3" mass bias with your PAP would put your key on the VAL. This is a controlled drilling in asymmetrical balls, which would give you the reaction you are explaining.

And to add to what Riggs said, it is the altering of the shape of the core by using a balance hole that is changing the motion, not the static weights. You are just playing inside the guide lines that USBC allows with static weights to use large holes to alter core shapes to enhance or restrict the performance of a ball.
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VideoBallReviews

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #5 on: September 15, 2009, 09:22:51 AM »
quote:
First thing, why not 4000 with no polish??

Second, I don't have a ball in front of me, so I may not be 100% correct, but I think that a 5" pin, and 3" mass bias with your PAP would put your key on the VAL. This is a controlled drilling in asymmetrical balls, which would give you the reaction you are explaining.

And to add to what Riggs said, it is the altering of the shape of the core by using a balance hole that is changing the motion, not the static weights. You are just playing inside the guide lines that USBC allows with static weights to use large holes to alter core shapes to enhance or restrict the performance of a ball.
--------------------
Tommy Gollick
Storm Regional/Pro Shop staff
Red Crown Pro Shop Harrisburg, PA
stormbowling.com


I think Tommy and Riggs hit this one on the head...5x3mb makes balls fairly smooth for me, you may not be seeing roll out per say, but more of a "rolly" type of reaction.  I put this layout on assym. to achieve a controlable ball reaction throughout the entire lane.  With a combination of the aggressive core and cover on this ball, statics really shouldnt play a big role.

I actually drilled one of my VEs with a 5 x 3 layout, but with a 4.5" pin buffer that pushed the pin below my fingers.  In this video you can see the difference between this ball and my other one i drilled 4.5 x 4.5" MB x 2" PB

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nOTkhqH5YYE

I then took the 5x3 ball and did some surface changes...as you can see the ball remained controllable but the overall hook potential increased with each grit.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3YFg-j5PJx0
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Mr Straight Ball

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #6 on: September 15, 2009, 11:49:44 AM »
Question: What did you want the ball to do?
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snowspike1

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #7 on: September 15, 2009, 12:12:00 PM »
I have a post on this same thing and even tho it may have been rolling out or not i was still scoring with it..

I tried to take a prior teammates advice (mainly cause he ave. 20-30 pins more) but the more i think of it, he was afraid of my shot that night.

One comment on my thread used Chris Barnes as an example and yes the ball was more like a rolling out hook set.  

His comment got me only because during my summer league this ball wasn't working for me and i was tempted to change the surface but held off till the winter league house (more oil).  It is the only ball i have drilled pin down and still not sure on that drilling but will give it atleast 2 more weeks before i change.
The first (day) of that league i tanked the 10th frame with a greek church then chopped the 10 off (oops) 218.  i switched balls to a toxic and lost everything  167. went back to the VE and shot 256. (641)
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rctc286

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #8 on: September 15, 2009, 02:57:58 PM »
I am more of a lower rev player, mine kinda does that to.  I try to play down and in and couldnt carry the 10 pin.  Then I practice after the game moved 5 boards left, ball hooked more then what it was and then carried the 10. I think like most high end balls it needs oil to conserve its energy for the pocket to give its drive.
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OneEighthBritish

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #9 on: September 15, 2009, 03:08:30 PM »
Most of the times I have seen this ball thrown it looks like it rolls out, with and without polish.  Although I have never thrown it, it appears the ball generally transitions very quick through its hooking phase into rolling when it hits enough friction.
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Bluff

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Re: Virtual Energy Problems
« Reply #10 on: September 15, 2009, 04:45:34 PM »
not enought oil
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