Author Topic: Machine w/ MB left of thumb (Read 3101 times)

splendorlex · « **on:** August 10, 2006, 07:55:44 AM »

Is this necessarily bad to have the MB placed left of the thumb for a right handed bowler? My Father in Law has one drilled like this, and I told him it might not be good for that particular ball (he went to a new driller), and I'm wondering what the general consensus is. His pin is below the ring w/ the cg 2" right or so, there is a balance hole as well on the grip midline.
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Djarum · « **Reply #16 on:** August 11, 2006, 11:56:57 AM »

One of the things I've noticed about the Ones around here, the MB is always to the left of the pin and cg. This really sucks because then you MUST put a weight hole to get it back to legal if you want to have the MB on the right side of the thumb for a right hander. I hope track's assyms aren't all like that.

Dj
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tenpinspro · « **Reply #17 on:** August 11, 2006, 01:52:49 PM »

quote:
Hey Rick, I know a guy with a very inverted track(further away from thumb than fingers) that always lays his MB left of thumb. I have seen him throw other balls with MB right of thumb and they do not work at all for him. With the MB left of thumb he still seems to get the balls full track flare and performance though. Does this have to do with his PAP being down vs. up?

Exactly Slop, due to the fact that his vertical movement on his val is downwards, mb's right of thumb are now much closer to pap and will cause the weight block to flare or migrate faster. Therefore, by placing it left of thumb, it helps create the required amount of delay/skid which then results in the "proportionate" amount of skid, hook and roll for that bowler.
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quote:
That sounds like my track. Although I have no asym. equipment with MB left of the thumb, I do have great success with pins LEFT of my bridge. Like pin above/below middle finger (right hander). Since regionals out here in the east seem to be putting down low volumes of oil, I was thinking of doing some MB left of thumb equipment.

Hey Eric, it should also work well for you if you already can utilize pins in the negative finger quadrant. It also depends on how high the track is for the inverted player as well. If he/she tracks very high inverted (near fingers and thumb), he/she also risks the chance of rolling over the finger holes (seen this before also).
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quote:
I thought that WAS what I said, EL Presidente???

LOL...Yes you did Charlest, I just thought I'd use numbers to help paint the bigger picture. Wasn't sure if everyone else understood you.
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It varies from ball to ball based on core design and strength. Some can be utilized in this manner while some can cause you to flare back towards the gripping holes.

Look at it this way guys (w/o getting technical), we have 2 controlling weights in an asym ball (pin and mb). If we place one weight to the left of our hand and then the other weight to the right side of our hand, what do we get? The weights fight themselves or offset each other (generically speaking) causing quite a bit of delay in the the overall motion.
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Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl. - Amateur/Pro Shop Staff
Vise Inserts Staff
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Edited on 8/11/2006 2:02 PM

jls · « **Reply #18 on:** August 11, 2006, 03:02:15 PM »

very good reply's here, in most case's you would not want it drilled that way.
however, there are many older bowler's using tamer equipment, and when they get into a new high tech ball, it could be overkill for their styles.

we have drilled 3 machines for bowler's that way { by their request }
and they get along fine with it. they are looking for length with a smoother
controlled backend. also there { believe it or not }are many bowlers who do not want a balance hole in their balls.

most younger bowler's probably would not want their ball drilled in this way.
they are looking for hook, hook, and more hook, and backend.

as a ball driller we try to match a drilling towards the style of the bowler.
this is one of the things i don't like about ebonite putting the big x on this drilling for their Ones. i have had talks with many bowlers who get along very well with that type of drilling, on a certain condition. mostly older bowler's.

but for young guys, it's the kiss of death.

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jls31316

tenpinspro · « **Reply #19 on:** August 11, 2006, 03:29:37 PM »

Very well stated jls, typically not recommended but can be used for a specific condition or reaction.

quote:
also there { believe it or not }are many bowlers who do not want a balance hole in their balls.

LOL...Don't you hate this?...LOL Then they complain that it doesn't hook like the "other" guy's ball...lol
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jls · « **Reply #20 on:** August 11, 2006, 03:59:01 PM »

we have to do a lot of explaining to them. and that takes way more time than just drilling the ball with a balance hole.

but strong drilling's are not for everyone.
so we just try to match up a drilling to their style that they can work with.
also, keeping in mind, that most bowler's are still using a bread and butter ball. the word arsenal has no meaning to them.
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jls31316

splendorlex · « **Reply #21 on:** August 11, 2006, 04:04:51 PM »

Thanks for all the replies, guys.

I really appreciate it. As far as my Father in Law, he is what I would consider a down and inner. He likes to play down the boards around the second arrow, and he has lowish revs and speed around 15-16 at the pin deck. He also has a suitcase-like release, and might be considered a bit of a "spinner." I personally noticed the ball often seems to lack power at the pins, leaving 5's, 8's, 10's and such on solid pocket hits. I'm thinking that the layout of the ball may be why. Part of the problem is that we play in an old wood house, so there is always a LOT of hook to be had, and he wants to try to control it. I suspect he may have said he wanted more control when the ball was drilled. Thanks again!
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I'm not a bowler, but I do play one on Ballreviews.

If you don't like Wrigley, you might as well leave the country and join the Taliban.

jls · « **Reply #22 on:** August 11, 2006, 04:12:15 PM »

keep us posted on how he does with the ball. he made need a little coverstock
adjustment. but i think he will be ok.
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jls31316

CoachJim · « **Reply #23 on:** August 12, 2006, 03:11:25 AM »

Splendor, make sure that the person who drills the ball is going off of your Father in Law's positive axis point and not just placing the pin and mb in relation to the fingers and thumb.

If you Father in Law is a low tracker or "spinner" then placing the pin to the right of the fingers is like placing the pin close to a pin axis position for a high tracker. This type of pin placement makes the ball roll earlier and have less motion on the back end. If this is the case it would explain the weak hits on strike shots, these drillings are usually used by high rev players, who are looking for a controlled reaction off the break point.

Most ball drillers that don't know what they are doing place the pin at "1:30" to the center of the grip and place the cg in the center of the grip because they don't know where to put the weight hole if they do anything else with it.

These clowns usually stretch the span past any level of comfort and put a ton of reverce pitch in the thumb, so much so it ensures the bowler will develop hand and wrist problems, as well as never be able to release a ball properly.

tenpinspro · « **Reply #24 on:** August 12, 2006, 01:05:01 PM »

quote:
If you Father in Law is a low tracker or "spinner" then placing the pin to the right of the fingers is like placing the pin close to a pin axis position for a high tracker. This type of pin placement makes the ball roll earlier and have less motion on the back end. If this is the case it would explain the weak hits on strike shots, these drillings are usually used by high rev players, who are looking for a controlled reaction off the break point.

Most ball drillers that don't know what they are doing place the pin at "1:30" to the center of the grip and place the cg in the center of the grip because they don't know where to put the weight hole if they do anything else with it.

These clowns usually stretch the span past any level of comfort and put a ton of reverce pitch in the thumb, so much so it ensures the bowler will develop hand and wrist problems, as well as never be able to release a ball properly.

Wow...amazing, great explanation Coach Jim. I also see these same errors in my area. The stretched span came about in the 60's or 70's I learned and it was called a "full" fingertip vs our "relaxed" tip. It puts a ton of strain on our tendons, just simply horrible.

The 1:30 standard layout came about sometime in the 80's I'd say when they (Faball) stumbled upon the pin out when one of their cores shifted during the curing process. Amazing how these drillers have been stuck in some time warp that they never advanced their drilling techniques into the present.

Splendor, this may not be bad for your father in law but it still depends on how much head oil there is to help him skid and conserve some energy downlane. If they're real dry up front as well (blk/wht and assuming he stays at 10 board), the ball may use too much energy up front and still hit a little flat on the backend. Keep us posted as jls stated, thanks.
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Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl. - Amateur/Pro Shop Staff
Vise Inserts Staff
www.Trackbowling.com

See profile for Track Ball videos

*El Presidente of the Track Legion

Author Topic: Machine w/ MB left of thumb (Read 3101 times)

splendorlex

Machine w/ MB left of thumb

Djarum

Re: Machine w/ MB left of thumb

tenpinspro

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jls

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tenpinspro

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jls

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splendorlex

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jls

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CoachJim

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tenpinspro

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