win a ball from Bowling.com
« previous next »
Pages: [1]

Author Topic: Drilling up a HAVOC  (Read 1800 times)

srlunatic

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4316
Drilling up a HAVOC
« on: March 27, 2004, 03:25:55 AM »
Greetings again!

I know I am becoming a big pain in the Buttocks ain't I??...lol....

Have a NIB Havoc.....

3 3/4 TW
3-4 Inch Pin.....

Was wondering on a drill pattern to make this react somewhat similiarly to the trusty VooDoo of years gone by?  I have a very high Track and if I place the pin below.....I clip the thumb.....though figure since wanting length that would be out of the question.  Also if I place the pin just above the fingers..(say less than 1" or so) I end up clipping the thumb again.  Was thinking of something like this.....(with serious polish job included..;-)..)

     P

 0  0

  cg

  0

         mb

Right now have a V2 Clean and Columbia Spirit....V2 can get started early if needed and Spirit is long ball...was seeing if I could possibly get a reaction in between these?  Am I asking too much??..lol..

Excaliber
tenpinspro
AUS Lefty

Feel free to help me out!!>.LOL..

Thanks again for all the help!!

Mike
--------------------
My personal savior is common sense.
How can being so RIGHT be so very WRONG?
Logged
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

 

tenpinspro

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4161
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #1 on: March 28, 2004, 02:53:59 AM »
Hi Mike,

The correct answer to your question is....buy a Crash.  I'm sorry, I'm not trying to be sarcastic but the Crash does have the same or very similar weightblock with a little stronger cover.  Here are a few number comparisons,
they actually appear to be fairly close with the Crash having a little more backend.

----------Crash--------- Voodoo

RG---------2.54-----------2.52
Diff--------.047-----------.048
Backend-----8--------------6

 
However, if you want to drill the Havoc to be close, I'd recommend placing the pin above your ring as far out as needed to not roll over the thumb, cg in your palm, and mb in the thumb area(left or center is okay).  The look I'm trying to describe is more of a 1:00 cg to pin.  This should give you very good length with some backend.  The key here though is to polish it up a fair amount because Aus Leftie, Excaliber and myself have this ball hooking quite a bit.  A. Chapman however didn't get such a strong reaction but he placed the mb in a weaker position or maybe we just have more hand then he does.  That's why I'm suggesting placing the mb in a weak position because this ball has appeared to respond to the different layouts very well.  Hope this helps and feel free to contact me if you have any further questions, thanks.
--------------------
Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Pro Shop Staff
Vise Grip Staff
Logged
Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Co-Founder - Tag Team Coaching
"El" Presidente of the Legion

charlest

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 24526
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #2 on: March 28, 2004, 06:19:05 AM »
I'm with Rick on this one. I have to believe that trying to make a Havoc into  VooDoo may be extremely counterproductive. The surface can be made close (sand to 800 and polish to about 2000 grit), but drilling to make that core into something it's not may be very frustrating.

The Havoc is designed for a different reaction than the VooDoo. The Crash, I suspect, WAS designed to be a more modern VooDoo, one of the few skid/flip solids.

Both should have the same strong reaction, but on different oil patterns.
--------------------
"We get old too fast, and too late, smart."
Logged
"None are so blind as those who will not see."

C-G ProShop-Carl

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 5825
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #3 on: March 28, 2004, 09:25:30 AM »
Mike.....I was thinking what Rick said before I even paged down to read his post.

In order to get it close you are going to have to use alot of polish and probably a label drill, placing the MB somewhere left of the thumb (for righties). The Crash would definately be a better selection. The Havoc just wants to start up too quick. If you cannot make a trade for a Crash, just play with the surace a bit until you get it close.

Goodluck,


--EX--
Logged
Carl Hurd

Austintown Ohio (Wedgewood Lanes)

900 Global, AMF Staff Bowler

Tag Team Member #1

<b><i>TAG TEAM COACHING!!!!!!</i></b>/

srlunatic

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4316
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #4 on: March 28, 2004, 10:35:40 AM »
Greetings Everyone!

I had a funny feeling that this would be the responses I got after checking out the Crash..:-0))

Do have a question about drilling the Havoc.  After reading some posts have heard it is a pretty strong and will start up quick.  Here is question 2 then.....*laugh*....

Have an Animal drilled up pin just right and slightly above ring finger....mb in right quadrant (strong position)...with weight hole on pap.......and have a Phenom Unleashed drilled pretty much exactly the same.  Both my Animal even slight dulled and my Phenom have very good length which I really like.  Can I drill the Havoc to go earlier than both?  I am not a very big fan of stacked leverage as have had limited success with it...and with the long pin not sure if could drill as early as I would like?

Any ideas??????..

Thanks again for all the help!!!!!

Mike

--------------------
My personal savior is common sense.
How can being so RIGHT be so very WRONG?
Logged
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

tenpinspro

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4161
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #5 on: March 29, 2004, 03:28:42 AM »
Hi Mike,

Am I being tested or something?  Again, this is not the intention or natural characteristics of the ball.  It isn't designed to be more then the Animal or Unleashed.  It can be drilled however to roll early but you would definitely have to change the coverstock quite a bit to handle the heavier oil.  I personally haven't tried this nor do I recommend it as well.  I believe Charlest words fit once again here as trying to do this would be "extremely counterproductive".  

When I mentioned the ball was strong, I meant it was strong relative to the medium light conditions that it was designed for.  I apologize if I confused you in anyway.  Actually, the first drilling recommendations to you were not a bad idea because you could polish it lightly and it'll give you a different reaction then the Unleashed and Animal.  Hope this helps...
--------------------
Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Pro Shop Staff
Vise Grip Staff
Logged
Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Co-Founder - Tag Team Coaching
"El" Presidente of the Legion

srlunatic

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4316
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #6 on: March 29, 2004, 03:52:14 AM »
Rick,

Greetings and thank you for all the help!  Will probably go with your first suggestion on the drill pattern.  Looking forward to giving this ball a go.  Track has been producing some seriously good equipment and they really make me look like I have a clue at this game...*laugh*.

Thanks again!

Mike
--------------------
My personal savior is common sense.
How can being so RIGHT be so very WRONG?
Logged
They that can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety deserve neither liberty nor safety.

tenpinspro

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 4161
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #7 on: March 29, 2004, 07:05:41 AM »
You're welcome Mike,

That sounds like a plan.  I agree with you on Track making US look like we have a clue.  I went on a dry spell for 6 years, no 300's.  Played with a few patterns and tweaked the covers on a few balls and JACKPOT, (3) 300's in one year with 3 different Track balls in 2 different houses...thank you TRACK!
--------------------
Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Pro Shop Staff
Vise Grip Staff
Logged
Rick Leong - Ten Pins Pro Shop
Co-Founder - Tag Team Coaching
"El" Presidente of the Legion

Strider

  • Hero Member
  • *****
  • Posts: 6759
Re: Drilling up a HAVOC
« Reply #8 on: March 29, 2004, 01:30:10 PM »
quote:
The reason for the placement of the MB there is because this ball spins on a Z axis.


What are you replying to?  The ball isn't drilled yet.



quote:
The placement of the marked MB on The Havoc is not where the ball will flare or spin to. If you place the MB around the thumb (1"or closer) you will have a weak layout. To maximize the reaction, either lay out the ball in a label 1:30 or a 10:30 with the pin above for more lenght or below the pin for more roll.


Can you explain further?  1:30 and 10:30 just mean core orientation.  You can drill either and still have the MB near the thumb.  Pin over middle finger, CG in palm will make a 10:30 and put the MB near the thumb.

Also, MB halfway between the track and VAL (usually an inch or so right of the thumb) is usually considered a very strong drilling.  Is everything (still not much) that I know about drilling (asymmetric) balls wrong?


quote:
If you don't have any experience with the Determinator, Find someone who does.  It will make all the difference in your new ball that you drill for your self or customers in the future.  Del and Mo were great for us setting it up and educating our shops with its use some 2 years ago.

The Doc
--------------------
I know T. Webb
Do you know him?


[url="http://www.somoff.com/forums"]


Can you give us a quick version of what they taught you?
--------------------
Penn State Proud

[url="http://www.bowl4fun.com/ron/roncarchive.htm"]Ron Clifton's Bowling Tip Archive
Logged
Pages: [1]
« previous next »