Author Topic: MB of the kinetic line (Read 1055 times)

BXTECH · « **on:** July 02, 2008, 01:43:15 AM »

does the MB have a larger affect on ball reaction over the CG because the int diff is between .006 & .008?
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DEFEAT is only MOMENTARY!!!!!!

I have no special talent, only passionately curious!

Grayson · « **Reply #1 on:** July 02, 2008, 09:53:53 AM »

mhhh... good question.

the thing is that... in a sym ball the "MB" is defined by the cg (which is the thing why on sym balls the cg is the second important value... you could also use the fictional MB and use a asym drill pattern but keeping in mind that this ball has no real MB which has no "real" influence.. I say it has... CGNOMADDAH discussion here wi com again

)...
on a asym core it actually has a second prefered spin axis which is and can be /as far as I know/ determined and imho is more important than the cg... otherwise the marking would be obsolete, no.

I'd use the MB and refer to the asym drill pattern as it marked and for sure has an influence
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Sebastian Koch
"Have fun and bowl well!" - Grayson
"Some things are made so even idiots won't fail using them.... But I ask what about the genius?" - Grayson

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Edited on 7/2/2008 9:55 AM

BXTECH · « **Reply #2 on:** July 02, 2008, 10:39:13 AM »

even though the company marks the ball (kinetic)with a MB, from the shape of the core( shuttle) it appears more symmetrical which gives the impression that the CG would be of more importance than the MB when drilling? If i am far off please let me know.
--------------------
DEFEAT is only MOMENTARY!!!!!!

I have no special talent, only passionately curious!

louf846 · « **Reply #3 on:** July 02, 2008, 11:50:44 AM »

CG really isn't important on symetrical balls except in terms of keeping within static weights. When you kick the CG far enough to need a weight hole, the weight hole is what has the greater effect on changing ball reaction versus the CG. With the lower int diff of .006 and .008, the differences in placement will create a minimal change in ball reaction. Even symetrical balls have a mass bias, it is just in the same place on every ball (6 3/4 from pin through cg) so it is not labeled. There is a minimal effect on this as well when you place it in different spots.
Several people consider .008 and higher to have a noticeable effect on ball reaction and to be "truly" asymetric. From the several Kinetic/Kinetic Energy I have drilled, mass bias placement has made a minimal effect. I have two KE, both pin 5 from PAP, one has 70 degree drilling angle, one 45. They reacted virtually Identical. The 45 degree was over static weight. I then placed a weight hole in the ball and it now is a completely different ball.
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Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

BXTECH · « **Reply #4 on:** July 02, 2008, 12:58:07 PM »

Thanxs for both of your insight.
--------------------
DEFEAT is only MOMENTARY!!!!!!

I have no special talent, only passionately curious!

Mark T. Trgovac · « **Reply #5 on:** July 02, 2008, 02:19:17 PM »

quote:
CG really isn't important on symmetrical balls except in terms of keeping within static weights. When you kick the CG far enough to need a weight hole, the weight hole is what has the greater effect on changing ball reaction versus the CG. With the lower int diff of .006 and .008, the differences in placement will create a minimal change in ball reaction. Even symmetrical balls have a mass bias, it is just in the same place on every ball (6 3/4 from pin through cg) so it is not labeled. There is a minimal effect on this as well when you place it in different spots.
Several people consider .008 and higher to have a noticeable effect on ball reaction and to be "truly" asymmetric. From the several Kinetic/Kinetic Energy I have drilled, mass bias placement has made a minimal effect. I have two KE, both pin 5 from PAP, one has 70 degree drilling angle, one 45. They reacted virtually Identical. The 45 degree was over static weight. I then placed a weight hole in the ball and it now is a completely different ball.
--------------------
Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

Lou here is correct. Also keep in mind that after a 'Pre-drilled' symmetrical ball is drilled and it is now completely Asymmetrical. The MB on these are also not marked because after drilling it will randomly shift on the ball. You can find it with a deTerminator, but the ball in most cases will spin to the biggest hole I.E. the thumb or it will just spin forever and never spin to its MB. The number that shows significant reaction changes is different depending on who you talk to. Some people think .008 and higher has an affect. Then there are those who don't think it matters till you get to .010. It is all somewhat based on what you see after drilling.

However as to the Kinetics and Tempers, drill them as if you were drilling a normal Asymmetrical ball, just know the MB placement will not have a strong significant affect in reaction.
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Mark "scoot" Trgovac
C-G Pro Shop
Official "Spokesman"
Youngstown, Ohio
Track HITMAN.

Tag Team Coaching Success Story.

Happily distributing the red pills of CGNOMADDA. "if you take this pill, YOUR MIND WILL BE OPEN TO A WORLD NEW IDEAS."

Grayson · « **Reply #6 on:** July 02, 2008, 03:19:06 PM »

I assume that style has a very big influence?
--------------------
Sebastian Koch
"Have fun and bowl well!" - Grayson
"Some things are made so even idiots won't fail using them.... But I ask what about the genius?" - Grayson

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Grayson · « **Reply #7 on:** July 02, 2008, 04:21:16 PM »

quote:
Lou here is correct

For those of you that don't know

60 percent of the time...LOU is right EVERY TIME !!!!!
--------------------
Jeremy Hunt
Hammer PBA Regional Staff
"NOTHING HITS LIKE A HAMMER"
Vise PBA Regional Staff

60% is not scientificly valid

--------------------
Sebastian Koch
"Have fun and bowl well!" - Grayson
"Some things are made so even idiots won't fail using them.... But I ask what about the genius?" - Grayson

(\_/)
(x_x)
c(')(')

Unoffical Ballreviews.com FAQ
Hot Water Bath - instructions and experience

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Billy Ray · « **Reply #8 on:** July 02, 2008, 06:32:55 PM »

quote:
Lou here is correct

For those of you that don't know

60 percent of the time...LOU is right EVERY TIME !!!!!
--------------------
Jeremy Hunt
Hammer PBA Regional Staff
"NOTHING HITS LIKE A HAMMER"
Vise PBA Regional Staff

Hey Buddy hows the other part of the family out there in Big MO?
Havent talked to you guys in a while. Hows the new Hammer stuff working for you?
--------------------
Billy Ray
Track Pro Staff
www.raysproshop.com
"Let Us Help You Become More Competitive"

louf846 · « **Reply #9 on:** July 02, 2008, 08:40:38 PM »

I believe that is Sex Panther, not me.. LOL
I don't open my mouth unless I at least think I am right.
Jeremy, you bowling any of our fine Central region events coming up? We have a few actually in Indiana including one that is close enough for me to sleep in my own bed!

quote:
Lou here is correct

For those of you that don't know

60 percent of the time...LOU is right EVERY TIME !!!!!
--------------------
Jeremy Hunt
Hammer PBA Regional Staff
"NOTHING HITS LIKE A HAMMER"
Vise PBA Regional Staff

--------------------
Louis Franzetti

Track Regional Staff Member

Author Topic: MB of the kinetic line (Read 1055 times)

BXTECH

MB of the kinetic line

Grayson

Re: MB of the kinetic line

BXTECH

Re: MB of the kinetic line

louf846

Re: MB of the kinetic line

BXTECH

Re: MB of the kinetic line

Mark T. Trgovac

Re: MB of the kinetic line

Grayson

Re: MB of the kinetic line

Grayson

Re: MB of the kinetic line

Billy Ray

Re: MB of the kinetic line

louf846

Re: MB of the kinetic line