Author Topic: Rule today? (Read 2414 times)

Aristotle · « **on:** August 23, 2004, 01:05:08 AM »

Well.. Last week, I ended up getting my AU, which I still haven't had a chance to throw since the docs cut me open, but at the same time, my Rule was ordered and I just get the feeling that I should most likely get it today. From past conversations, it has been said that I should leave this ball in box condition for my oil ball (replacement of EMB), but how should I lay it out? I want something for oil that acts like a reactive. Something that gets through the heads cleanly, then takes off the last 20 or so feet.

clintdaley · « **Reply #1 on:** August 23, 2004, 09:39:09 AM »

Without watching you, my general advice would be for you to drill the Rule with the mass bias in a weaker position for you. With this mass bias being the strongest to date in any Track ball, putting the mass bias in a strong position will make the ball want to go early, which is NOT what you want if you want some backend on this ball. I would suggest keeping it in out of box condition and see what you think.

Any questions, please write!

Clint Daley-Owner
Lets Go Bowling Daley
Salem, Ohio 44460

C-G ProShop-Carl · « **Reply #2 on:** August 23, 2004, 12:39:31 PM »

Aristotle

Normally I would suggest placing the MB closer to the thumb, but with what I have seen of the Rule, go strong with the MB. I drilled one leverage for a customer and placed the MB on his VAL (he wanted to experiment with an early roll drilling since he had never tried it). What he gets is early roll, but he gets very strong backend reaction as well. He throws the ball at roughly 14.5-15.5 mph (on quibeca computer speed) has about 300rev rate. You may not want to place the mb on your VAL, but placing it about an inch inside of your VAL would be safe. You could even go a little further from your PAP with the pin, say 3 3/4 of an inch, if you are comfortable I would suggest staying low with the pin placement, like 1 - 1 1/2inches above your midline.

The surface on this ball was taken from box to 800grit scotchbrite, so it has some surface to it. Getting the kind of backend reaction out of a ball with this strong of a MB and with this much surface is almost unheard of, but that is what he gets out of the ball.

If you have any other questions, message me

-EX-
--------------------
C-G Pro Shop (owner/operator)
Youngstown Ohio
cgproshop@yahoo.com
Track Advisory Staff

clintdaley · « **Reply #3 on:** August 23, 2004, 01:14:48 PM »

It is really hard to determine where a mb should be put without watching the bowler, seeing what else they have in their lineup helps. But, yes, you can put the pin and cg in the same spot, have the same cover, you can put the mass bias (especially stong mb, as is the Rule) in 2 diff positions, and you will see 2 different reactions. I have not done this yet in the Rule, but I did see in the Animal, who drilled 2, put the first mass bias in his track and the second mass bias 1" right of his thumb, and the second ball was stronger overall than the one with the mb in the track (had some extra kick for some nagging 10s on a carrydown second shot) pin under right finger, cg in palm on both.

Clint

Edited on 8/23/2004 1:18 PM

Edited on 8/23/2004 1:19 PM

C-G ProShop-Carl · « **Reply #4 on:** August 23, 2004, 01:44:24 PM »

Clint, not knowing Aristotles stats (revrate, tilt ect...) is why I listed the stats of the bowler I drilled the Rule for.

Aristotle.....one thing that I wanted to add to my post:

"something for oil that acts like a reactive".....this is very difficult to occomplish. If the oil pattern is long and flat reactives will not be able to get back through it. If the condition you are on is that heavy of oil, it is difficult for anything to make it back unless you are playing straighter. On "true" heavy oil you cannot expect a ball to "take off". If you have very slow ball speed and alot of hand you may be able to get this kind of reaction. The Rule is the better choice if you want more power in the backend...just do not be afraid to adjust the cover accordingly.

-EX-
--------------------
C-G Pro Shop (owner/operator)
Youngstown Ohio
cgproshop@yahoo.com
Track Advisory Staff

clintdaley · « **Reply #5 on:** August 23, 2004, 01:50:30 PM »

Carl, was replying to Bob, not you, sorry for the confusion!!!!!!

Clint

tenpinspro · « **Reply #6 on:** August 23, 2004, 02:11:30 PM »

Hey Aris,

As Ex and I recommended before, let's keep the mb strong on the Rule because you had asked for strong arc to snap. If you place the mb too weak, it may weaken the ball too much and make it resemble or overlap the Untamed which is not what we want. Ex and I were trying to help you keep a nice separation between the 2 balls.

Placing the mb in a strong position will NOT make this ball roll too early for you based on your lower track. Placing it past your val will help do that but not if it's only in the strong position.

Please post your reactions and layout with the Untamed after you get a chance to throw it and that will help us layout the Rule as well for what you want.

quote:
With this mass bias being the strongest to date in any Track ball,

I also had to correct myself before, I thought it was too but looking back at the Unleashed, it's showing .017 and the Rule at .016 as the intermediate diff. Hope this helps...

**Bob7, placing the mb in a strong pos on this ball will make it roll earlier only compared to a weak mb but not as early if it were on or past val. I personally have mine at 4mb (strong pos) and I still have plenty of finish. Roy Munson even has this on tape which we will be editing to try and put on BR for all to see.
--------------------
Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl. - Amateur/Pro Shop Staff
Vise Inserts Staff

Aristotle · « **Reply #7 on:** August 23, 2004, 05:55:35 PM »

Rick, I think that what I am going to end up doing with this one will be to place the pin just above the finger bridge and the MB over into the strong position (ends up being about 1.5" right of thumb). I know that pin over the finger line does some weird things to these cores, but with the way that the CG is set up, I would end up with a ton of thumb weight if it was any lower. As it is, I will likely end up close to the 1 oz max which I don't want. Gonna have to weigh the thing out before we put in inserts just in case I need to go a little deeper with the thumb hole.

clintdaley · « **Reply #8 on:** August 23, 2004, 08:47:36 PM »

Aris, I would agree for you to go with what you rpeviously discussed with Ex and ten!

Bob, I was recalling my experience with AMF Angle Evolutions, which I drilled many for me and for people in Excalibur Pro Shop in Camelot Lanes, and I had 2 original Angle Evolutions, both of the surfaces out of box, pin below ring on both and cg in the palm. The only diff was the mass bias on one was in my track and the other was just to the right of the thumb, just as the 2 layouts I described above on the Animal for a friend of mine. I saw on the ball with the mb int he track, it reacted less up front but saved a little more for the backend, where the one by the thumb seemed like it started earlier (was great on a fresh shot!) but as carrydown came later on, seemed liked it wanted to hang some 10s on me. I bowled against Carl for 2 years in the Camelot Summer league, and basically was throwing AMF both years, and if he remembers (it has been 3-4 years) by the 4th game (we changed pairs after every game) I would switch to another ball as I would hang 10 after 10. But I do have a faster spped and my track is within 1/4 of my fingers and thumb, so I am end over end all the way.

Clint

clintdaley · « **Reply #9 on:** August 23, 2004, 08:59:41 PM »

Thats why I hate to say how to set-up a ball for someone I never seen throw.

Clint

Aristotle · « **Reply #10 on:** August 23, 2004, 11:10:04 PM »

I'm a pretty low track with high rotation. Fairly close to being a spinner, which most likely account for a good portion of my rotation. Unfortnately, I have never measured anything, so giving specs is a bit difficult. Just consider it slightly above average rev rate and speed with a low track that the pap varies from 4" to 4 3/4" depending on pitch and what I'm trying to do with the ball.

tenpinspro · « **Reply #11 on:** August 24, 2004, 05:25:11 AM »

quote:
with the way that the CG is set up, I would end up with a ton of thumb weight if it was any lower

Aris, from the sounds of this, is it a long pin from cg(like 4+)? If so, please be careful and have your driller double check the mb distance from your pap. If it ends up under 3, that will produce max revs and cause the ball to roll very early and stable on the backend. Even though the physical positioning of the mb may be next to your thumb 1.5 inches, this does not necessarily mean that it's in a "strong" position. Always measure the distance to pap to achieve the desired reaction(strong). Pm me if you have any questions..
--------------------
Rick Leong
Ten Pins Pro Shop
Track Intl. - Amateur/Pro Shop Staff
Vise Inserts Staff

Edited on 8/24/2004 5:35 AM

Aristotle · « **Reply #12 on:** August 24, 2004, 01:09:11 PM »

I took a look at the layout before anything was done. It is over 3" from pap. We were going to drill everything yesterday except the driller got a call from his other job and had to run off. I will double check the measurments today if we manage to get to the ball.

Author Topic: Rule today? (Read 2414 times)

Aristotle

Rule today?

clintdaley

Re: Rule today?

C-G ProShop-Carl

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clintdaley

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C-G ProShop-Carl

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clintdaley

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tenpinspro

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Aristotle

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clintdaley

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clintdaley

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Aristotle

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tenpinspro

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Aristotle

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