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Author Topic: JBT Havasu  (Read 2202 times)

Lane1fanatic

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JBT Havasu
« on: October 30, 2005, 03:37:56 PM »
Ok I usually don't complain about tournament formats but this one takes the cake.

Straight from the JBT website.
Format: Two separate standings for girls scratch and boys scratch.  All bowlers roll 12 games of matchplay, 6 games each on two different conditions.  In games 1-11, you are bowling everyone else on your pair, with bonus pins going to 1st (50 Pins), 2nd (30 Pins), and 3rd (20 Pins) highest games on the pair.  Game 12 is a traditional position round, with 1st playing 2nd, etc., with a 60 pin bonus for the win.

With only 4 people on a pair with 3 of the 4 getting bonus's doesn't seem right to me. Also the bonus pins is too high, 50 pins for first is almost impossible for someone to make that kinda wood up. Without having a finals is really a bad idea also. Every JBT besides the Invites have a top 5 or top 8 so I don't understand why this didn't either. I know this tournament was put together in a short amount of time, but it could really have been a lot better; not to rag on any JBT guy's. I know a great deal of people that wouldn't bowl this tournament again because of the format, so I guess they have some reordering of the format to do.

Also with Havasu lanes putting out a sport shot in the first 6 game block and not even stripping for the second 6 is just stupid. Am I the only one that knows that if you don't double strip a sport shot your just laying down another pattern ontop of that pattern? Well what does everyone think about?


 

Platinum Bowler

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #1 on: October 30, 2005, 11:46:36 PM »
Oh, now you know why a few of us out here didnt show up...sucks, cause that was always one of my fave tourneys of the year.....


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Farewell Tour 05'-06' "No Mercy"

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B-Car

jbtsouthwest

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #2 on: October 31, 2005, 12:49:46 PM »
Hello,

As those of you who attended Lake Havasu know, I (Jeff) was running our NM-TX tournaments this weekend, and was not at the Havasu event, so I'll let Mark, the director for that event, make specific comments.

However:
  - The format was reduced to one day at the request of the center, and for lack of a director who could get there for two days.  We had two and a half weeks to prepare for this tournament, which otherwise would have been cancelled.  We tried to make an exciting one-day format for you.  If it failed, we certainly won't try it again.  Someone still walked out of there with guaranteed $400 and $250 first place prizes, I can't imagine they had an awful time.

  - For those who didn't like the lack of finals, I don't ever want to hear from you again if you lead a tournament by 200 pins and lose as the top stepladder seed, hee hee!!!   :-)   Seriously, we hear you, it sounds like we should have had a finals, but didn't want to change the format on the fly.

 
  We're pretty proud of our events, but if this was a bomb, then it was a bomb.  We all just should have stayed home and worked on our Halloween costumes.  We hope SOME of you had fun, especially the winners of the couple thousand dollars in scholarships that were awarded.  We hope you enjoy better our other 70-plus tournaments and $200,000 in scholarship money up for grabs this year.

  I'll be honest, it pretty much sucks to have three of our biggest stars (and money winners) come on this forum and rip us.  I know you said it's not on JBT, but the format, but dude, it looks really bad.  You're totally entitled to, don't get me wrong, but someone who reads this thread as their first ever now has a pretty poor opinion of us, and that makes me pretty sad (and nauseous).  Remember how you guys felt, multiply that by me trying to please everyone, and it makes for basically a lousy week, hehe.  

   Two of you three have been kinda ripped at times on these boards in the past, verrry unfairly.  What I'm saying is, if Havasu sucked it sucked, but if everyone who was there already knows it, I'd ask you to simply communicate directly with me, instead of post it on a board where, as we discuss endlessly, things get misinterpreted constantly.  B-Car, as someone who is involved on the running-tournaments end of things (not to even mention one of teh best junior bowlers in the country), I'd think you'd have an understanding of why I'd ask that.

*********

This is the second time in a week that some of our formats have been critiqued by folks.  The few people that post on here are hardly a fair sample, but what I'm hearing from you guys is, basically, don't screw with the format.  Is that really what you want, 70+ tournaments a year exactly or close to the same?  I would think that would be boring.  Please send me comments directly to my email.  Most of the scheduling will be done in the next two weeks, so we need all the input we can get.  We want all our events to be fun and worth bowling.

Thanks,
Jeff Hemer, JBT SW
www.jbtsw.com

jbtsouthwest

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #3 on: November 01, 2005, 10:56:37 AM »
Theo,

Let me reiterate this one more time:

HAVING A ONE DAY TOURNAMENT WAS NOT POSSIBLE THIS YEAR.

WE HAD LESS THAN TWO WEEKS TO PUT THIS TORNAMENT TOGETHER, and tried to come up with a good one-day format.  If it sucked, it sucked.

I'd like to THANK Havasu Lanes for hosting us.  I'm sure they regret the error in not stripping off the sport shot better.  They also contributed a LOT to the prize fund- Havasu Lanes has been a big supporter of junior bowling for a long time.  Judging by the gratitude I read here, I'm going to feel like an idiot asking them to contribute to the prize fund in 2006.  Ever wonder why it's so hard to get sponsors????

IF we run this event in 2006, we will of course have the time to arrange it to be a two day event, and will most likely use the "old" format (which, by the way, hasn't drawn a lot of entries).  Again, given this nightmare reaction, I wonder why I'd even consider it.

Let me say it again: IT WAS NOT POSSIBLE TO RUN A TWO DAY TOURNAMENT THIS YEAR.

I've talked to some more folks who attended the event.  It seems to be pretty unanimous that folks would have enjoyed a stepladder, and that the house shot was screwy.  Some people liked the points, many didn't.  BUT, I've also heard that Mark and Tami ran a very fast, efficient, professionally run event as far as anything in their control, and I'd like to THANK them for their time and efforts.

Again, I respect your right to post your opinions, but you've gotta look at what you're saying!  We hear all your comments loud and clear- you can be sure we won't run a system with those point totals for a while (see the thread I'm about to write on mega-matchplay's points for a counterargument, however)- and we (JUST LIKE YOU) want a two-day format.  Your comments ARE heard AND respected, and future tournaments will be diffrent because of them.  However, it is ridiculous to bash the host and the directors for things that are OUT OF THEIR CONTROL!!!

Finally, I was just sent the pictures of the finalists, and noted that none of the people who were angry finished in the top of the field.  I understand that you would have hated the format either way, but it couldn't have helped that you didn't win.  I get that, remember I'm a bowler, I don't like formats that I don't win in either (which, of course, is EVERY format for me)....

You guys, our veterans, should know (boy I hope it shows) that we love what we do and here to try our best to please everyone.  It upsets me personally greatly to read stuff like this.  We want you all to have a great time and win lots of money, but when we fail we want you to understand that it's not for lack of trying.

Thanks,
Jeff Hemer, JBT SW
www.jbtsw.com

jbtsouthwest

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #4 on: November 01, 2005, 11:41:48 AM »
Theo,
 
 Steven wasn't in the picture, so I didn't know he did well.  Good for him- he's an awesome bowler that can adapt to any lane condition.  It was just an interesting thing to notice, that's all.  I fully realize that even the top finishers had things they didn't like about the format.  

 Again, IF we run this event next year, it will be a two day event. IF, for all the reasons stated above.

 Sounds like a prime example of why we say at our standard events, "be ready for any lane condition at any time".  Pre-announced lane conditions are a great way for a director to end up with egg on their face, no matter who they are.

 I firmly stand behind and re-emphasize everything I've said in above posts.

Thanks,
Jeff



OGrady

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #5 on: November 18, 2005, 11:24:26 AM »
I don't understand what all the fuss is about.  I appreciated the format, lane conditions, and the way the event was fun especially.  Mark Fiener ran a nice event in my mind.  Its not often where I can jump on a plane and bowl a JBT SW, but the experience was worth it.  50 pins a game for a win puts a premium on the ability to win all of your matchs.  Isn't that the idea in winning a tournament, the ability to beat everyone?  

Ive known Mark Fiener for several years before he moved to Vegas.  Stand up guy and cares alot for Junior Bowlers.  Sorry for arriving late to Havasu Mark.  Freakin cops pulling people over, jeez.  

The lane conditions were very suitable for the format of the event.  I have never favored high field averages for any tournament.  Granted the second block was the house condition, at least they did re-oil and fresh heads were in play.  On the east coast, we hardly ever see an oil machine being rolled out in between blocks of a tourny.  

Nice event.period.
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OG

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Good Luck to Bill O'Neill on Tour this year.

OGrady

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #6 on: November 18, 2005, 11:25:00 AM »
I don't understand what all the fuss is about.  I appreciated the format, lane conditions, and the way the event was fun especially.  Mark Fiener ran a nice event in my mind.  Its not often where I can jump on a plane and bowl a JBT SW, but the experience was worth it.  50 pins a game for a win puts a premium on the ability to win all of your matchs.  Isn't that the idea in winning a tournament, the ability to beat everyone?  

Ive known Mark Fiener for several years before he moved to Vegas.  Stand up guy and cares alot for Junior Bowlers.  Sorry for arriving late to Havasu Mark.  Freakin cops pulling people over, jeez.  

The lane conditions were very suitable for the format of the event.  I have never favored high field averages for any tournament.  Granted the second block was the house condition, at least they did re-oil and fresh heads were in play.  On the east coast, we hardly ever see an oil machine being rolled out in between blocks of a tourny.  

Nice event.period.
--------------------
OG

www.Buddiesproshop.com/  all your bowling needs at an affordable cost....offering frequent package discounts and specials on balls, shoes, and accessories.

www.jbtbowling.com/

www.sportbowling.com/

Good Luck to Bill O'Neill on Tour this year.

Lane1fanatic

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #7 on: November 18, 2005, 11:54:35 PM »
That's not what you said after the tournament Matt

OGrady

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Re: JBT Havasu
« Reply #8 on: November 20, 2005, 10:32:55 PM »
lol haha....cuz i then realized i had to drive 2 hours back to vegas in the stinkin desert...most boring drive everrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrrr......
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OG

www.Buddiesproshop.com/  all your bowling needs at an affordable cost....offering frequent package discounts and specials on balls, shoes, and accessories.

www.jbtbowling.com/

www.sportbowling.com/

Good Luck to Bill O'Neill on Tour this year.